Episode 272 - Mentoring the Next Generation of Techs with Luke Murray and Charles Burke of Worldpac

0:02Hey folks, David here, and I'd like to thank you for joining us for the Changing the Industry podcast. Lucas and I started this podcast with the goal of capturing the frank and open conversations you typically have at industry events. Those conversations cover the challenges we face in our business and lives, as well as difficult repairs, new products and services, and everything in between.

0:26We hoped that these recordings would spur our listeners to enact the change they'd like to see in their own lives and businesses. That's also why we've partnered with the Institute for Automotive Business Excellence. My first management class was with Cecil Bullard, and his genuine passion for helping others in an honest and ethical manner permeates his entire organization. And if you need some of the Institute's help, they have a special offer for our listeners.

1:00Click the link in the show notes and get signed up for a free business analysis. They'll go over your current situation and give you advice on your next steps. And they have everything from free resources and online classes to peer groups, one-on-one coaching, and specific help for MSOs. So don't miss out on this great offer. Click the link in the show notes.

1:26And now on to the podcast. Now you did it. Are you sick, David? I think I ate something that was a little off last night at Flights. Yeah, said something about the brownie or something. I didn't eat it. I didn't have the brownie. Did you have the brownie? No. There you go. I had the brownie. Uh, well, he goes, hey, uh, somebody said don't eat the bread.

1:55I'm like, what bread? He's like, I don't know, he said don't eat the bread. And I'm like, I didn't see any bread. So I ate the food and I'm like, I have a brownie. Ate the brownie and then— sorry, the brownie did not agree with me. Yeah, yeah, he didn't feel good from the time he left. Um, as soon as I ate it, like, Doris was— yeah, food poisoned her first night here.

2:17Doris, really? Yeah. When you say it like that, Doris was food poisoned, it really sounds like a deliberate act. Yeah. Blue. Sometimes it is. There was a guy that was, uh, there's a, there's a chain of steakhouses in Kansas City. They're about all closed now. And there was a guy that was deliberately poisoning the food with, um, It was his excrement. He was putting it in the food.

2:49Oh my gosh. A bunch of people got sick. They traced it to the guy. Yeah. To one of the workers there, and he admitted to deliberately doing it. Then he moved to Vegas. Yeah. That's making bread. It worked a lot better. He got, I think, 10 years in jail. Wow. It was bad. Gentlemen, introduce yourselves. Charlie, we'll start with you. Alrighty. Well, thank you for having us.

3:14This is awesome. My name is Charlie Burke. I am with Whirlpac Training Institute. We are part of the Whirlpac Wholesale Parts Program. We are now owned by Carlyle and we are ready to go into our next new generation here. And so I manage the business development training. We do technical training, we do management training, and Luke and I manage the business development training group.

3:39We have peer groups, we have free lunchtime training, we have online training, in-person training. We sponsor instructors at all the national events. Yeah, we have our final capstone STX event every 2 years. This year it's in August. And oh, and we also do a WorldPac cruise, but there's no training on the WorldPac cruise. So every other year is STX, cruise, STX, right?

4:05Right. We— so yeah, I'm just going to tell you that after going to STX one time, you understand why it has to be every 2 years. Because that is a lot of work. It takes 2 years to put it together. Yeah, it's insane. I mean, that sucker is insane. Luke, introduce yourself. Luke Murray, and I do the same thing Charlie just said for the same company.

4:24But I was— I only moved over to the business management training side last year. And prior to that, I had 12 years on the technical side. Started as a trainer myself, technical trainer. And then WorldPac hired me in 2018 to manage their whole Euro brand training program. And build that up. A couple years ago, I stepped back from training myself because I'm a firm believer that, you know, when you have a subject matter expert in front of the room that's teaching something, they better be doing what they're saying.

4:54Right. And when I went to work WorldPac full-time, I left the shop, brought my toolbox home, and the information was relevant still, but I started to feel a little detached. And I just, I never wanted to be that person in the front of the room Right, you know, right, this is how you do it. And then do what I say. I don't know, I've never actually done it myself.

5:15Yeah. Uh, and so, so I stepped away from that and really was able to then just focus on building up that team, uh, right, the whole Euro Training, uh, program. And then last year I'm like, this is as far as I can take it, you know, and, uh, let's, let's let somebody else take the helm. So Brandon Matthews came in and runs the Eurotraining program now for WTI, and I stepped over to work with Charlie because— You mean to keep Charlie in line.

5:41Exactly, yeah. Well, Charlie was a one-man show. I mean, the technical side has a huge team and a big support. Charlie's over here. Charlie's by himself. I showed up in 2017, we had 3 instructors. We're now working with over 80. Wow. Coaches, trainers, CPA firms, firms, tax strategists, financial advisors, legal. As long as we've been friends, I don't think I've ever heard where you came from or what your story was.

6:11Ah, yeah, yeah, thank you. Yeah, well, I guess I, as a little kid, I was always into the car stuff. And, and, you know, got through— my dad owned a whole bunch of real estate, you know. I was his go-to for the plumber, the electrician, that, you know, as a little kid. And I, I just, I was born that way, right? I loved everything mechanical.

6:30And then I got into high school and had a lot of cars in the yard. I was fixing them, friends would drop them off, and started collecting tools and did my thing. Got my ASC master certification and went off to college. And aviation, aeronautics engineering. Wow. And wanted to fly jets. And in my junior year in college, I was a bellhop at a hotel.

6:55And I took a champagne cork to the eye, knocked me on the floor, tore 3 holes in my retina. Holy cow. I got up off the floor, I'm like, I'm fine, I'm fine. I go out into the, you know, I close the door behind me, I cover up the good eye, and I look up at a light bulb and it's like nothing.

7:13So straight over to a hospital for 7 days on my back, and, and, you know, for about a year they were popping my eyeball out, and, and I still have 3 holes in my retina. Yeah, so I couldn't fly anymore, you know. Yeah, I went off and I was ground transportation for TWA. Remember TWA? Oh yeah. And, uh, and I was doing a lot of aviation stuff, but I just wasn't, I wasn't being fulfilled, you know.

7:34I wanted to fly, and I did fly for a while, but I couldn't fly people, you know. Right. And so, um, so I was at breakfast one morning with a, with a, with all my friends, and, and ordered my meal, came out, wasn't my meal, it it was someone else's breakfast. I stood up and I ripped the waitress like a new one right there.

7:53All my friends are like, dude, what's wrong with you, man? I sat down, I said, I quit, I just quit my job. And that's— then I got into— I said, I love cars, you know, what can I do? Yeah. And, uh, I ended up in publishing for 30 years. Really? Yeah. And so I wrote textbooks and engineering books and, and European stuff, you know, Porsche, uh, you know, I wrote some stuff for the factory and I did that for 30 years.

8:20And so I worked very closely with WorldPac. They sold a lot of our books. Okay. And, and then 2017, we closed the publishing firm down because paper is what it is. Lucas and I have been telling you about PartsTech for a while now and how it gives you access to unlimited parts and tire vendors and direct integration with over 35 shop management systems.

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9:34Hey, one more thing. If you find out that your shop management system doesn't integrate with PartsTech, it's time to upgrade. David and I use what we believe to be the very best system on the market, Shopware. With unmatched features like Parts GP Optimizer and DVX, which is their digital vehicle experience, Shopware really is way more than just a shop management software. With it, you'll be able to create an immersive and interactive experience for your client, setting you apart from everyone else using run-of-the-mill software.

10:00Are you ready to upgrade? Click the link in the show notes to get started. I had Google and YouTube, and, you know, got to the point where I'd be working on something and I'm just like I can't get to page 488 as fast as I can get to YouTube to show you how to do this thing. So it was really cool, you know, it's just a paradigm shift that, that, uh, it's amazing the power of, of, you know, the internet now.

10:22And yeah, so, so I did that for a long time and then we shut the group down and in 2017 I came over to WorldPac. Okay. And, uh, I was like, like Luke, I was a technical guy then, right? I do have an MBA. And, uh, and Rob came to me, my boss Rob Morell came to me and said, hey, you know, this, this management program needs some, you know, someone's got to love it.

10:43Yeah. And, uh, and I'm like, I'll try. So here we are. Yeah. And you have done a phenomenal job with the management program. Thank you. Changed a lot of people's lives for sure. A lot of shops. We talked about one of the award winners, was it Shop of the Year? Yeah, yeah, Shop of the Year. Yeah, yeah. And, and I remember before they were in the 20 group or in the program, the SMART group, and I remember where they were.

11:07Yeah. And I've seen the transformation to where they're at. And it really just takes some knowledge to help get there. And WorldPAC's always been a master of providing that knowledge. I have got a video clip of Shari with a testimonial about where she was and how the peer group helped her, for sure. Get, you know, yeah, amazing. I mean, it's life-changing stuff.

11:29It really is. Yeah, it's a great way to say it. Absolutely. Luke, I know your story, okay? Okay, I do. Um, and, and I think you should share part of it, but I just want you to know something. Yeah, you asked David, like, your story at dinner the other night in Salt Lake City. Yeah, kind of like made me question like all kinds of things.

11:51Oh wow. Okay, like, and what I mean by that is, and I know this is— I'm not gonna ask you to share anything you don't want to share, but you were talking about your stepson. Yeah. And that, like, that woke me up to the things that are important in life. Yeah, right. And like, I just want you to know that that passion that you showed for a human being that is not your own child, right, and is going through something like that speaks volumes about the human being that you are.

12:19Thank you. Yeah, I would love if you would share a little bit of your past and a little bit of that story, because absolutely, I think that would touch people. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So I mean, I came into this industry accidentally, right? I had this, this passion project from a child to open a video pizza delivery company, right, with the entire business model based on the laziness of the American consumer.

12:44Right? Everybody's like, oh, it's Friday, what are we going to do? Pizza and a movie, perfect. You know, you order pizza, you have lots of options, but you have to go to the video store, right? The Blockbuster, if anyone remembers those. And, and, but at that point now you're leaving the house and suddenly you're like, well, now we could maybe pick up some McDonald's, or let's get frozen pizza at the grocery store, whatever.

13:04So if I don't have— if you don't have to leave the house, I'll bring the movie to you and the pizza And that business model, I don't even have to have a good pizza, right? People will get that though. I'll settle for that pizza because I want the movie there. And it drives repeat customers because now you got to return the movie.

13:21What do you do? Just order another pizza tomorrow. We'll come pick up the movie, right? And I shared this business model with my high school teacher, and he's like, I want to go into business with you. And it was the first adult that ever showed interest and passion in an idea I had. I was like, I was like, wow, like this might actually work.

13:38But then early 2000s, DVDs, internet, Netflix mail order. I saw the writing on the wall and I'm like, this business model is done. Movies are going to get to people's houses in another, in another way. And, and so I'm like, oh, now what, right? Yeah. So I went back to school, I did an EMT class. I was like, I'm gonna be a firefighter.

14:00And then a really close friend of our family, Henry Hink, from Schneider Autohaus in Santa Barbara, California. I've known him since I was a child. He's practically my uncle. And he was over at the house, big family barbecue, and he was talking about his desire to emulate an apprenticeship program like what he went through. He was from Germany, and he went through the German structured apprenticeship program that really focuses on not just being a mechanic, but the entire industry, how to be to be a shop owner.

14:30Yeah. And, and all of those hard business skills and soft skills that are necessary to be successful. And he's like, there's nothing like that here. I want to do that. I want to have an apprentice and teach them all this stuff. And, and I'm, I'm listening to it going like, that sounds amazing. Like, what a great opportunity for somebody. I would totally do something like that.

14:49It's like, really? And I was like, yeah, come on down to the shop. Went down, met the owner. Henry Hink wasn't the owner at time. He was a technician that just wanted to mentor somebody, and I got hired. And, and, you know, I was always pushed to, to be curious. They made me go to trade school at community college, so I was in school half the day, in the shop the other half of the day.

15:10You know, summer breaks, I was working full-time. And, and, uh, graduated that program, got pushed into— they hired me as a full-time, uh, tech. And I just, I never stopped having a desire to learn. The shop had access— it was a— I, I became a BMW specialist. It was a BMW Porsche shop, and they had access to TIS, right, which is, you know, uh, the information system.

15:31They had— they would buy an annual subscription, and I just— I discovered the training manuals on there, and I just started reading them and consuming information, learning things. And, and, uh, just— I was always curious. And, and then I wanted to share that knowledge, so I got involved in tech forum groups and started helping people fix cars and teaching them how it works to understand why that's how it broke and why it broke.

15:54And, uh, I was going to training events. I got to a point where the instructors started to fear me in the class. You know everything. You're always going to ask a question that I don't know the answer to. Like, you should be teaching. Okay, why not? So I, I did a class and it was successful, and then WTI brought me on as BMW instructor.

16:15Uh, I was the BMW engine subject matter expert. I did that from 2010, uh, until '22. Uh, and, uh, just that was it— BMW engines, developing that content. I am a little nostalgic that you're not teaching anymore. Little bothered by it. People are. Yeah, it's— I, I hear that a lot. And, you know, I will get back into training without a doubt.

16:38I need to discover what my next discipline is going to be because I don't, you know, I want to know that what I'm teaching, I'm doing, and I can truly be passionate about it. I have no problem teaching a class on technology, like why, why are they using this? What's the goal? What's the purpose beyond just emissions? But there's, there's a reason behind the madness.

16:58I could do that, but I don't know that that's necessarily the be-all end-all of training. You know, they also want to learn how to diagnose it. And fix it and do it efficiently and save time. But right now, I think, I think my, my goal, my passion is, is to focus on mentor training. You know, I think that's something that's lacking in the industry is, uh, you know, I had a great mentor, but you know, I think Henry Hink could have done even better with like some mentor classes.

17:25Yeah, what would that have done for me? And so many shops out there, you say, oh, we want to, we want to bring on an apprentice, you're going to be under this person, they don't have the necessary skills. Yeah. Uh, to understand what it means to be a mentor, to how to lift somebody up and elevate them and drive that curiosity to want to excel.

17:44And that's just content that's lacking for sure in our industry. And so, so that's, that's kind of my goal. That's, that's where I see myself coming back into training, uh, and doing it again. And, uh, and, you know, that's You brought up my stepson Benjamin. Yeah. So he, he's my hero. I mean, without a doubt, the bravest person I know, born with cerebral palsy.

18:10So umbilical cord wrapped around his neck and, and, you know, choked him, starved him of oxygen. And as a result, he's hemispatial. So half his brain is dead, essentially, right? Zero brain activity. He goes to a neurologist every year, does a full brain scan, check it out to see what's happening. And, and, and that's the way it is. And that in and of itself is so hard, right?

18:32Right. Hemispatial, which means so that half the brain controls the whole half of his body, right? And everything from, you know, his, his legs and his arm, you know, he has very limited mobility. And, uh, and that's tough, but a trooper. He goes to physical therapy twice a week, you know, to stretch his his muscles. You know, twice a year he has surgery to extend his tendons, and it's, it's non-stop.

18:57And then if that wasn't enough, right? Yeah, when he was 7, 3 years ago, uh, we're finally getting into a good roll and here comes Lucas interrupting the episode. Folks, now you know exactly why I hire Shop Marketing Pros to do my shop marketing. It's that I am spastic and all over the place and I lack consistency. But here's the thing, That doesn't work in marketing.

19:23You see, marketing takes 30, 60, sometimes 90 days to be effective, and I was all over the place with my marketing. There was no consistency at all. Caused these waves in my business because I was so inconsistent. And that's why I am so happy to refer Shop Marketing Pros. They bring consistency. They are true professionals. I'm going to encourage you, go down to the link below and get your free digital marketing inspection.

19:54Just like we do digital vehicle evaluations for automobiles, they're doing the same thing about your marketing, and they will help you get your business turned around. Uh, type 1 diabetes, just went into diabetic ketoacidosis, shut down. It's— I mean, type 1, it's a, it's an autoimmune disease. You're born with it, and it's at some point it just happens in your life. Maybe when you're 5, maybe when you're 50, who knows.

20:19And, uh, there's, there's no way to test that it's going to happen. Yeah, it just, it just happens. That's how you discover it, is by almost dying, right? And, uh, and so now he's insulin dependent. He has a, he has a pump. We have to manage his diabetes. And, and, you know, filling syringes and all that stuff is challenging enough, but imagine having to fill syringes and prep infusion sites when you only have one working hand.

20:45Right. And so, I mean, and every day he's just, he's got a smile on his face. That was the thing that stuck out to me is that like, I get that he didn't know anything else. Right. But the fact that he has persevered and like as a parent, that's hard to think about. Yeah. Right, like that's hard to think about as a parent.

21:05Seeing your child in that situation or that position. And, and he's had a lot of other challenges too, but what really stood out to me about that conversation, we were talking about his hand. Yeah. And you're talking about like, hey, you've got to work your hand. Yeah. And, and the fact that you spent the energy that you did to slow down and understand and mentor him about working on his hand.

21:28Yeah. Was impactful for me, and I don't know why. Yeah, like that. The fact that— because you're a stepdad. Yeah, right. Yeah. The real dad's not even in the picture. And the fact that you took the time to spend with a young person that's going through that, to teach them, that speaks a lot about who you are. But I mean, it also speaks to that mentoring capacity.

21:51Oh yeah. Right. And an obligation we have to the youth of our country today that I think is lacking in a lot of ways. Yes. Big time. You know, there's nobody there to do that for them, and parents aren't doing it for them. So kudos to you. I mean, I think that's— thanks. Even, even in our industry, we have— yeah, I can't think of anything we have out there that does any mentor training at all, you know.

22:12So yeah, you actually gave me a great idea there, and, uh, I think we should bring a mentor training class, a leader, you know. I think mentorship is leadership, you know. Yeah, yeah, you define it. Yeah, to STX, we do an We do a 4-hour class on that. Yeah, for sure. And these techs go in there and say, what's it mean to be a mentor?

22:29Right. I don't think anyone understands the role of a mentor. Well, we've not defined it. Exactly. Not in our industry. Right. You look at the SP2, we talked about SP2 the other night, and that's a massive program. I mean, it's like a 4-week program to go through that. It is a lot to go through. Is that the safety? Yeah. Yes. They have a whole mentorship program where they teach you how to be a mentor.

22:50And what we're seeing— and we just talked to a shop owner that was in here just a few minutes ago, and he was saying, oh, I'm gonna, I'm gonna raise up these apprentices and I'm gonna show them how to do the thing. The problem is you can burn an apprentice by not being present and not actually teaching them. And I've done it.

23:06Yeah. And so it's a lot of work to have an apprentice or someone that you're mentoring. And it's not as simple as saying, I'm gonna pay you less, go do this thing, right? No, we have to teach them how to to do this thing. Yeah. You mentioned, you know, the German apprenticeship programs or mentor programs. Yeah. And even you go back 30, 40, 50 years, they talk completely differently than we do in our society today.

23:32Yeah. Right? And we do not have this mentorship type program or apprenticeship type program that has structure to it. We're independent, man. Exactly. You shared the thing about the blacksmith. Yeah. And where did a journeyman come from? Exactly. Yeah. So I think that's a good place to start this conversation. Perfect. I, I, I was doing research on putting together a training event at STX.

23:57Charlie and I both worked on it together. We put together a panel on, you know, showing shop owners what it takes to build a grassroots apprenticeship program in their shop that fits their needs specifically, because this, this industry is so independent that the idea that we could just have an apprenticeship in a box program that people sign up for and it will work, yeah, that's never going to happen.

24:17It needs to fit into that shop's culture. The shop needs to have a culture and good culture, yeah, and, uh, in order for it to work. And so I did a lot of research, like, like, why was my apprenticeship journey successful but so many others aren't? I refuse to accept the fact that it's because I am just awesome, right? And I would have excelled at no matter what I did.

24:37I was like, there's got to be something else in there. Yeah, we definitely know it wasn't. That definitely wasn't it. So, uh, so I looked into it and, and I learned that the word journeyman, where it comes from, and it's— it was an awesome story. So I'll use the blacksmith example. I think it's perfect. So back in the day, you know, you had, you had a blacksmith and he had a shop set up in a, in a village, an established village.

24:58He lived above it. That was house. That was his whole life. And when he brought on an apprentice, it was somebody very young, you know, I don't know, 12, 13, who knows, you know, it was a long time ago. He only lived to be 22. So, and, uh, and so they, they not just— they don't just come to work, they come to live.

25:18Your apprentice lives in the house. Yeah, right. Every day is learning the job, learning the skills, not just on how to be a blacksmith smith and form metal, but how to prep dinner, right? How to clean up the house, how to take care of yourself. And the role of the master or the mentor was to teach life skills. Yeah, right. Not just job skills and career skills, but life skills, how to be a responsible adult.

25:44And then when they graduate from that program as an apprentice, they become a journeyman. And that comes from the fact that they were literally traveling. At that point now, you had a journeyman blacksmith who didn't have an established business set up. They, they followed the demand. So maybe there's a war going on and you need a blacksmith set up to fix swords and shields, and so you were there.

26:06Maybe a castle is being built and a new village is being established, so you come in and you help with that. And then eventually your journey ends and you're ready to settle down, and so maybe it's that castle club got built and a village is building around it, and you say, I'm gonna stay here, I'm gonna make a permanent brick-and-mortar establishment, and this is now my life, this is where I've decided to set up shop and stay.

26:29You're now a master, and now you bring in an apprentice. Yeah. And the process grows up underneath. Yeah. Charlie, is it possible for us to do that in the automotive space? Because I mean, it starts with shops, right? And it starts with the owner, or at least Management, leadership? You know, the business we talk about, you know, we have technician efficiency issues, we have issues around here, we're not charging enough, we've got all those problems.

26:57We don't have a technician shortage, we have ownership problems, right? We're not attracting the right people, right? We did, we did the, uh, the, the— so, so the title of that class we did was, was called, um, So You Think You Need an Apprenticeship Program, right? Sold out. Everyone came in, and it was, it was pure smoke and mirrors because really the whole thing about the apprenticeship in a box, which is everyone's version of, of hand me this and give me the curriculum and tell me what I need to do to this guy once a week and we'll get there, you know.

27:29And they don't understand that the role of the mentor, the life skills, that really it's It's heavy-duty leadership. You have to be a good leader to be a good mentor, right? So we've really covered all that stuff in this class. And we talked about it's your culture and it starts from the owner. Your business has to be operating efficiently and with profit.

27:50You have to give it the time and the space to really put your head into this as the owner of this business and pick the mentor. And it's not your top tech. It's not your— generally, it's It's not, you know. Yeah. And then, and then where do you find this person? Where do you find this person in your shop? And, and usually it's, it's the owner takes it on.

28:08And if his business is upside down and he's not able to pay payroll and he's like, you know, cars in the parking lot, that kid's going to be pushing a broom for the next 12 months. 100%. Yeah, absolutely. And that's ineffective, right? It doesn't do— all it does is upset them. Exactly. Now this kid is like this, and I don't want anything to do with this.

28:29And off he goes. 100%. Yeah, yeah. But, you know, a business model I thought about a long time ago is like, why can't we train mentors virtually, right? Why can't we be a— you know, there's a labor terminology and it's intermediary. Okay, yeah. Department of Labor intermediary. And we feel like as industry, you know, change agents here and what we're doing in the training model, we could be that intermediary and actually train mentors virtually.

29:05Right. Oh, that's a cool idea. Right now they come to training once a week, and then we have a peer group around it. We have a Zoom call around it, and they— what's working for you? What's working for you? It's It's heavy-duty leadership training is what that is, right? And, and we're not providing that. You know, the owner, if he does have a tech and if he wants to bring an apprentice in, he's like, you're taking care of him, teach him how to torque a wheel today, right?

29:29But it's, it's so sloppy. Yeah. And, and it— and, you know, Dwayne with— he has a very— Dwayne Mars Dynamic Auto, very successful. He was on our panel. Yeah, very successful apprenticeship program. And he's like, I will give you I will give anyone in this room my apprenticeship program. I'll give you the curriculum, I'll give you everything. But I guarantee you 9 out of 10 of you will fail within 12 months.

29:52Yeah, I can believe it. I've seen it. If you don't understand the impact it has on your business, and if you don't have the culture in place, you are going to fail. And if you don't have a good mentor in place. If you don't understand what mentoring is. What mentoring is. But we are in a great place to be that intermediary. And we have the tools now to do that.

30:11We have great tools. You know, I know a lot of coaches during COVID said, "We're not going to go out. We can't go out in person anymore. We can't do it." And they've adopted a model virtually that they say is so much more effective than the in-person. So we do have the tools. And I think the virtual training has evolved. We've become quite good at it.

30:30Jimmy Lee from the Institute says, "My favorite way to teach now." Yeah, for sure. Yeah, for sure. Do you, you know, you see a lot of the industry, and, and so if we're going to talk about this, we have to talk about the other side of this. And, and it's kind of what the meeting we were at was all about, is we're reaching a very small percentage of the industry as a whole, right?

30:49Like, you, you know, you would agree he knows the industry about as good as anybody, right? How much of the industry do we actually reach with the training and, and all the resources that we have right now, as far as shop owners, what percentage do you think we reach? 10 to 15. Okay. And, you know, I hate to say this, you know, but there's, there is a part of our industry that they are not going to help themselves.

31:15And no matter what we do down there, that bottom, they're just gonna, they're just gonna go on. Some of them will go on for 30 years and make a little bit of money, and usually one-man shops. And, you know, they do Okay, but that really, that sweet spot is like 85 to 70. That's the sweet spot that we need to get to.

31:34And all of these training events, we're seeing the same people, we're seeing the same— they're drinking the Kool-Aid, they believe in the model, they believe the importance of training. There's one way to do it. There's one way to do it. It's the only way I've thought of, you know. I know where we're going. Luke knows where we're going. David knows where we're going.

31:56Share. There's only one way. You live in North Carolina. Yeah, you live in— you live in a small— I live in Massachusetts. I get in my car tomorrow and I drive to every shop in Massachusetts and I tell them about the opportunities out there. I give them a little presentation and they're like, never heard about that, or go away, I'm not interested, right?

32:18But that's the only way we get Them. It's the only way we get to them. Boots. ATI, that was their model for the longest time. They came to town, they did a seminar, they took names and knocked on doors. Yeah. And they were very, very successful. Absolutely. And that's how ASTA grew to the size that it is today, is it was boots on the ground and it was shops who said, hey, I don't want other people to feel like this.

32:44I'm going to go I'm gonna connect with these other people that I know, and I'm gonna continue to share this. I'm gonna continue to spread the word. I'm gonna take steps to make this better. And my fear is, so you know Michael Smith from the Institute? Yeah. Michael's talking about consolidation, and Michael says we may have missed our runway here. We may be running out of runway before the consolidation hits, and we don't have enough time to clean it up and make it better to the point that we need it to get better.

33:10I don't know if that's the case or not, but it's, We've seen what happened to Collision, buddy. They're in rough shape, huh? Yeah. Well, I don't know. Maybe we can, you know, pizza and training. I don't know. Yes. Pizza parties. That's what Luke said, that they should have thrown more pizza parties for his training. He would have been a lot happier, you know?

33:28Yeah. But I mean, like, I think you're right. I think that's the only way to reach the masses. That's the only way I've ever thought of that we could, you know, because, you know, I mean, You know, TechForce, they've been out there for a long time, you know, and it's been difficult for them to, you know, are we attracting the young kids to our industry anymore?

33:48That's a whole nother conversation, right? That's a whole nother conversation. But the people that are in business now that aren't, you know, our job is to— it's very simple. Yeah, just take the business owner to one level up, one level up. Yeah, you know, we had I did a training yesterday here and there were about 30 folks in the class. I can't tell you how many were shop owners.

34:10Only one person knew what their ARO was in that room and it was a financial business class. Oh my God. So, so— That's rough. So there we have it. You know, I mean, they know they're making money, there's money in the bank and they are paying their taxes and they're doing all the basics, but you know, they don't have the time even to— I mean, it's a very simple calculation, right?

34:31Yeah. They don't have time to figure that out. They're riding the butt dyno. They're trying to figure out like, hey, is this thing making, making money or not? Bank account's going up. Sounds like it, you know. But, but I mean, that's just it, is how many people do we talk to that are in that exact boat? Yeah. And they're not making any efforts to change it.

34:48And many of them are unhappy, but they don't know what to do. But nobody's reaching out to them. Nobody's providing them resources are going to them and saying, hey, there's a better way to do this. Yeah, I do find that very difficult, you know. I mean, you, you mentioned something last night, you know, about that one owner just tripped over your podcast.

35:08Yeah. And he said it, it changed my life. Yeah, for sure. From that point forward, you know, and that's got to make you feel— absolutely. You know, it's a beautiful thing to hear, you know. That's what it's all about for us. And, and the, the thing is, is like, we've got a lot of content creators that are focused on making content to get views.

35:24We're focused on making content that changes lives to try and make the industry a better place to be. I don't care about the views. And David's right. Like, that's his whole mantra is like, I don't care if 50 people watch what we make. If one person watches it, says, hey, this is good, I'm going to share it with somebody else that needs to hear this, they're going through this and it makes their life better, then it's been a complete success.

35:48Like a raving success, not because it got 100,000 views or we got paid or something happened. But it is mind-boggling that someone can't Google, like, you know, automotive repair. You know, you did a, you did a podcast, a podcast like a, I don't know, a week ago or something, and, or, or just you were walking, your morning walk, whatever, and 1.85 margins and all this stuff, right?

36:10It was, it was, it was so cool, right? And you did it, I don't know, and 5 minutes, right? And you ran through the whole model of like, here's how you make money, right? And here's how you price it. And here's— and I bet if that— to me was so good, it was so solid, it was so simple, and you could wrap your arms around that.

36:30Yeah. But why are not— why aren't shop owners like using the internet to educate themselves? The resources, the podcasters, you guys? Because it feels overwhelming. Yeah, it feels like they're suffocated. It feels like they can't do anything about it, right? And, and they, they are comparing themselves to other shops, but they don't understand what the other shop's going through, right? Like, we always like compare ourselves and we say, hey, like, look how great Bob's Auto is doing, but they don't understand all the struggles that are happening behind the scenes.

37:04They don't understand what Bob's bills looks like. They don't understand, and so they're afraid to even say they don't see his road rash that is now healed. Exactly, exactly. And see, I, I— that's why I didn't— I didn't want to compare. Like, it was embarrassing. My shop sucks. I see all these other people, they're thriving, and then I go and I sit in a class, I'm like, well, wait a minute, all their shops suck too, because I'm hearing what they're saying.

37:26Yeah, we're all in the same boat, right? And I think that, that if we could get some awareness out there to help the them understand. And it's like people— David gets frustrated at me because he sees me answering all these people that message me. I was talking about one guy who he's like, every day he asked me a new question, a new question, a new question.

37:44And it's like, why do you keep answering him? Well, because he's hungry right now. And if I can give him some information, if I can lead him in a direction that helps him see things differently, then I've made an impact on the industry and I've moved us in a better direction. He may pay it forward. Right. And that's my hope is like if we get enough people on board with this and we get enough people talking about it, is it possible that we can actually shift the industry in a better direction?

38:06Sherri made a challenge to— Sherri Fesendt with her award yesterday made a challenge to everyone in the room and said, go impact one shop, go visit one shop and tell them what opportunities they have out there in training. For sure. You know, I thought that was awesome. And I'm going to do it when I get back. Yeah, absolutely. Go find a couple shops, share it with them.

38:27Make sure— no, no, you need a couple, right? Like, uh, because you see your, your stature in the industry, right? I'm going to expect 25 or 50 from you because that was a large crowd, and I would say there's a small percentage of them that are actually going to do it. So you and Luke are going to have to make up the extra, pick up the slack.

38:43Well, Luke said we're all lazy, so, you know. Yeah, yeah, right. I'll, I'll bring your pizza in your movie. So, but the other problem too is, and you mentioned it with just how overwhelming it is, like why can't they just go online and figure it out? It's so overwhelming. There's so much noise. Yeah. And even asking a question generates more noise. You ask a question, you get 200 different responses that then turns into their own arguments and you're like, oh my gosh, why did I even ask?

39:12I don't have the time to go through all of this. It's the shop management equivalent of the parts cannon, right? And so, so, okay, so we get in a van, we drive around, we visit shops, boots on the ground, right? Grassroots. But we need to make sure that when doing it, we're not contributing to the noise, right? Right. That the message is clear and that it resonates with these shops.

39:35Shares where there's good data to be had. Yes. Yeah. And the why. Yeah, right, because we're not just another sales pitch, right? Yeah. And so like you said, I want to change the industry. I want the shop owner to be successful. I want this industry to be viewed with respect. Yes, by the consumer. Right, all of these things to truly drive change in the industry.

39:58And we have to make sure that we're sharing that message in a way that resonates with a shop owner and shows the compassion right, that we have for this industry. Say, we, we want to help you be successful. Absolutely. We want to give you time back for your life, for your family. Yeah. And, and here's the thing is that there is some fear that has to be conquered.

40:21There's some things that has to— you've got to go through some stuff. Yeah, right. And it's not exactly comfortable. And so, you know, I, I kind of— I'm not gonna lie, the conversation we had the other night at dinner It kind of made me say to myself, toughen up, buttercup, right? Like, there's somebody going through something a whole lot harder than you could ever imagine, and they wake up with a smile on their face.

40:43Yeah. And you're over here complaining about something stupid, right? Like, toughen up, buttercup, let's get through it. You know what I'm saying? And I think the industry is going to have to toughen up a little bit. Totally. And it's probably— it's ingrained into the shop owner. I mean, as you're a technician, you're a problem solver. I mean, no tech ever wants to admit, I can't figure it out.

41:01Yeah. And you hear it time and time again. The technician that's been trying to diagnose this car for 4 days refuses to give up. I'm not even going to bill for the diagnostics anymore. I need the answer. And now that technician becomes a shop owner. Yeah. And they're in the same boat. Like, I know I can fix my business. I can figure it out.

41:21But in order to get a coach, to get professional advice on how to run a business effectively, yeah, with a business mindset, you have to first acknowledge that you can't fix it yourself. Absolutely. And I, I do think you're right on the fear part, you know. What's, what's, what's the opposite word for fear? It's faith. Amen. You gotta have faith. You gotta have faith.

41:43And, you know, if you can get in, jump out on a limb a little bit, faith mindset. Yeah, yeah. You know, and, you know, kind of a mentor of mine for, you know, Chris Chesney back in the day. Yeah. You know, he said, you know, the reason I succeeded in life is I was never afraid of anything. Right. It was a cool thing to hear, you know.

42:00And yeah, I attach myself to that. I'm like, I love that. And I think that's who I am too. That makes me laugh a little bit just because of a conversation I overheard yesterday. It would have been Monday afternoon. I heard somebody say, you know, Chris Chesney, I think he's getting close to retirement. And I said, why is that? And he said, Well, he said, all of the things that he had overcommitted himself for, he's now putting on my plate and saying, hey, why don't you go do this?

42:23I thought, that is the most Chris thing I've ever heard. He had no worries about jumping out on that faith to handle that. But he's a hoot. You mentioned the parts cannon. Does anyone sell one? Yeah, I need a couple of those. For sure. I need a couple of those. Well, how can the industry support WorldPac in making this happen? The mentorship program, the, the let's get boots on the ground and get shops involved.

42:48How can our industry and our listeners help support you guys in accomplishing this? Wow, thanks. Yeah. Come to class, you know, take advantage. We do free training every week, technical and management. Okay. Free training. And these are from top, top trainers. Yeah, for sure. You know, so, so jump in on that stuff. It's free. Okay, how do they find it? wti.worldpac.com. What is it?

43:16wti.training.com. Yeah, that one's easier. Yeah, it's easier, but I, you know, I just go out to Google and said WTI WorldPAC and up comes the training site. Awesome. But yeah, go online and, you know, we're starting peer groups again. We have the free training, we do online stuff, and And really the holy grail is to get the word out to the folks that don't know about us, you know.

43:40So if you're a shop out there that you believe in training, you believe in the WorldPac or whoever's training, you know, go visit a shop and tell them about it. Any of your neighbors. Just spread the word. And you know, this stuff is free. It's literally free. And that guy that stumbled onto your thing the other day, that's all it took for him.

43:59And it may just take one class and they're on their way. Exactly. Just a little bit of knowledge. When you come into one of those basic financial classes— Cecil Bullen did an amazing one— and you walk into that class and by lunchtime your eyes are so wide open, you're like, "I had no idea. This is the most amazing thing." And I would always say this is secret sauce.

44:21It is a secret sauce for success in our industry. Commit yourself to that. Now, that's the basics, you know. You gotta, you gotta get your financials in order, then you got culture, then you got hiring, then you got benefit, you know, you grow your— you know, on and on. It's got to start somewhere. Got to start somewhere. But you've got to get, you've got to get your— the core thing is get your financials in order, understand absolutely financial statements, and then you're, in my opinion, you're on your way.

44:45What, what percentage of shop owners would you say understand their financials that aren't in our circles? There's a lot in our circle that are afraid to understand them. It's overwhelming. Yeah, I don't even want to look at it. I'm not even opening that page. Right, right. So yeah, I don't know. I'll just say 10%. Yeah, I think you're right. I think you're right.

45:07Luke, what would you say to the technicians? You've always been the technical guy. What would you say to the technicians? We got a lot of them opening shops. We got a lot of them, you know, coming out here and branching into mentorship. And, and taking things to the next level, what would you say to them before we close? You know, always be curious, you know, discover, find out.

45:28You know, if we have a car that's always breaking, we can't look at that technology as like useless and unreliable. Look, look at the why, right? You should always focus on the why. And the manufacturers have a why. There's a reason they chose to do it this way. And when you look at it from that perspective, it actually becomes really cool and exciting.

45:48And yeah, sure, it breaks. They didn't do it dependably, right? But, but what they were trying to accomplish was awesome, and the way they went about it is incredible from an engineering standpoint, right? And, and if you can have that passion inside of you, I think that drives a desire to learn and, and be passionate and excited when We attach emotions to knowledge.

46:12We are— it's easier for us to retain that information, right? Right. And that's why we learn hard lessons so well, because there's an emotion attached to that lesson. Yeah. And if you have passion behind your training, if you're genuinely curious and excited about it, you will be able to retain that information more, and it will drive you to want to learn more.

46:31And so be curious, be excited, recognize that this industry is really cool, really cool, right? And there's so much to learn, and, and you will want to share that. And that's the first step in being an effective mentor, is wanting to share your knowledge, your life experiences. Yeah, no gatekeeping. Yes, no gatekeeping. Mindset shift. Work on your mindset. Get into that right place.

46:57Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Fellas, thank you for being here. Appreciate it. Pleasure's all on side of the table. Thank you, fellas. Thank you very much. Thank you for listening to the Changing the Industry podcast. If you enjoy the show, do us a favor and leave us a review on your favorite podcast player, and don't forget to set it to automatically download the latest episode.

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