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Confessions of a Shop OwnerMay 28, 2026 · 42 min

Ep 95 - Benjie Burris & Callie Johnson | Boobs, Business & Building Culture That Lasts

Shop ManagementCustomer ExperienceMarketing & GrowthIndustry Trends

Now playing — Confessions of a Shop Owner

0:000:00

About this episode

Tekmetric transformed my shop. Plain and simple. Want that for yours? Touch HEREIf you're like me and aren't good at marketing, don't do it on…

Key takeaways

  • —Community involvement is crucial for building lasting relationships and trust with customers.
  • —Effective shop management software can significantly increase repair order values and streamline operations.
  • —Networking at industry events can lead to valuable connections and opportunities for growth.
  • —Hands-on participation in community events can enhance a shop's reputation and customer loyalty.
  • —Using AI tools can improve efficiency and profitability in automotive businesses.

Frequently asked

How can community involvement benefit my automotive shop?
Community involvement helps build trust and loyalty among customers, making them more likely to return and recommend your services to others.
What are the advantages of using shop management software?
Shop management software streamlines operations, improves estimating processes, and can lead to higher average repair orders by facilitating better customer communication.
How can I effectively network at industry events?
Engage with other attendees, participate in social events, and be open to conversations to build meaningful connections that can benefit your business.
▸Full transcript

Funny story, we met over a pair of boobs. Boobs. B-O-O-B-S. Boobs. Boobs. Titties. Titties. Tatas. The tatas. Do tell. I had to go into the glove box to get a wheel key out of it, a registration card or something like that. And there's a pair of fake boobs in the glove box. And there's nobody there but me and her. So I walk into the office and I've got her fake boobs in my hand.

I said, hey, is there something you need to tell me? And I mean, we had never really talked a whole lot. And she's like, yeah, get your hands off my boobs. Yeah, I can hear that. Yep. And it was all love from there. It was love from there on. The following program features a bunch of doofuses talking about the automotive aftermarket. The stuff we or our guests may say do not necessarily reflect the beliefs of our peers, our sponsors, or any other associations we may have.

There may be some spicy language in this show, so if you get your feelings hurt easily, you should probably just move along. So without further ado, here's your host, Mike Allen, with Confessions of a Shop Owner. Presented by TechMetric. Simply the best software ever made. People who are listening now understand that what Braxton just said was really stupid and we just put up with it.

What's up, guys? Hi. Hey. We are here at Fueling Connections 2026 with ASTA. We snuck away Becky Witt is dropping knowledge bombs in the room down the way, but we are at UTI in Morrisville, North Carolina. Yes. Glad you got that right. Super. Well, it's— so it's UTI and then it's the NASCAR something institute. What? It's not institute. Performance Center. Yes, it used to be NASCAR Tech, but it's no longer.

Now it's UTI. And on this campus for UTI is the NASCAR Performance something something. Yes. Don't hurt yourself. It's okay. It's not my feelings. It's my head that hurts. Oh, okay. So that'll teach you to stay up drinking all night. Hydrate. It's key. So actually, I got in last night at like, I don't know, 10 o'clock. We had just got back from the restaurant.

I'm not going to lie. I was surprised when I seen you this morning. I really was. Because I was like, damn, Mike ain't even going to show up for this. What the hell? Well, I couldn't make it yesterday for the board meeting because I'm lame. But my kids had a tennis match. Kids, singular. One of my kids had a tennis match and it ran late and we didn't.

Just not go shoving people's stuff in women's space. Speak into the microphone. Speak into the microphone. How's the camera view for her now? That's got my whole face blocked. Jeez. Last time you didn't have a damn mic on. I don't look at me for that. And got called out on it, I might add. I recorded a whole podcast with no mic on.

That was Lucas's gear. It was Lucas's gear that he insisted that we use because it was gonna be way better. Trying to hold his sister down, that's it. And the audio was a hot train wreck of a mess, uh, and it was all Braxton's fault. Yes, he wasn't there at all and we were using somebody else's equipment. It's always weird when you use somebody else's tools.

It's like you go into a shop and use somebody else's toolbox. It's just Weird. Okay. That's what I've heard. I don't know. It's not like I've ever owned a toolbox. Braxton, I'll throw you a bone. I will say that I got complimented yesterday on the introduction for Tanika's podcast. Said, said, man, I just, I love that every time you come on, I kind of start laughing.

Is that good or bad? That's good. Well, did you add both? Did you do the intro recording for it? Is it you? That's awesome. Wait a minute. Hold up. Hold up. Hold up. Hold up. Wait a minute. You ain't even seen the intro to my podcast. I don't listen to anyone's content. None. I listen to my own. Not even— you can give me 30 seconds of your damn time.

Hang on, I'm going to do it right now. Uh-uh. No, no, don't listen to it. It's on YouTube. You won't have no service in here. Yeah, I connected to the Wi-Fi cuz I can follow instructions. I connected to the Wi-Fi yesterday and it still sucks. I'm just saying. Don't fuck with yourself. Well, you got to listen to it, but you're going to get feedback and crap and all this stuff.

Help me, Lord. Hey, Catagrace. This is Tanika. She has a podcast I've heard. It's like Downgrade with Tanika. What is it called? Okay. I see where we're going. Okay, where we going with this? I thought it was going to be friendly. We're going to do something together. But okay. It's called Downshift with Tanika. And I have a growing audience. I'm excited. I get excited when people say, I'm listening to the podcast.

It's so weird. I think you are going to take over the automotive podcast. Podcast world. We'll see. It's so good. I'm not gonna lie. I'm a little disappointed because I've hit the love on every single thing and I think I've made top engagement one time. Oh my God. It's because Buckaroo Buckin' Bob is on there. I know, right? He's on everybody's top engagement.

He don't do nothing but social media. Hey guys, Keri Lynne with Turnkey Marketing. If you are looking to increase cars and you're looking for the right demographic to go after, you want to get the right people who need auto repair right now. Then give us a call. We have a service called Direct Track and it utilizes AI to find people in your area who are the great demographic that you want to go after, have raised their hand and opted in saying, I need auto repair help right now.

We send them an email. As soon as they open the email, we then get their physical address, follow it up with commercial ads on all their streaming services like Hulu and YouTube and ESPN, Fox News, all those different things. And then we also get their physical address and we start sending banner ads and display ads to every single device in that house.

It has been incredibly effective. It has made shops seem like they're everywhere to those people who need repairs right then. And I mean, I'm telling you guys, the return on investment has been huge. So if you want to increase car count, you want to get great people in the door, give us a call or reach out to us and ask us about DirectTrack Marketing.

Running a shop for 20 years teaches you a lot, like how outdated systems can make your job a lot harder than it needs to be. I used to deal with slow check-ins, clunky estimates, wasted time chasing down updates. Then I switched to TechMetric. It's, uh, all-in-one cloud-based SMS that lets me run my shop from anywhere. It streamlines my estimating process, keeps customers in a loop with real-time updates.

I'm not telling you that it was all TechMetric, but I'm telling you that TechMetric was a big part of it. Since I switched, To Tekmetric, my average repair order 4 years ago was $293, and right now it's $916. That's not luck. It's better processes, faster workflow, speed of service that's facilitated by this technology helps me get higher and better authorizations from my customers.

If you're ready for a shop management system that actually works for you, tap the link in the show notes and check out Tekmetric. You're gonna like what you see. Come on, man. Do you have a job? No, he's catching fish on social media. I want to see his phone screen time report. Oh my Lord. Oh my goodness, I bet it's hard. I bet it's really hard.

It's like a toddler walking around. Well, his niece does that stuff, a lot of that stuff for him. She's doing a lot. You think he's got a social media manager with his login? Yeah, his niece does all of that, you know. Um, I can't remember her name, but she does it for him. It's Dawn, right? Dawn, yeah. Brian Pollock will occasionally send me a message and tell me who I've been fighting with on the internet most recently, because I don't engage with any of of our content almost at all.

Right. But he had, he'll just log in to the admin page and just start trolling the fuck out of people. I need to hire a troll under you. Yeah. And everybody thinks it's me that's talking. There was one dude, he was like, you know, it's obvious that you're an idiot and you don't know what the hell you're doing. I ran a successful business for XYZ years.

I didn't have to get rid of it until I had my divorce. And now I'm a service manager, yada yada. And so Brian was like, hey bro, cool story. If ever we need to do an episode on how to lose your business and your marriage at one time, we'll call you up. Oh my God. And I was like, does this dude live near me?

Do I need to be looking behind my back? Yes. He's like, nah, Jess, he's in California. Now I never know if I should respond to everybody. Like I usually, I had to delete a lot of them that were just rude. But I just, I stopped responding. I'll do a check or a heart every now and again. And then I'm just like, you guys are stupid, especially on TikTok.

This toxic, man. The comment section is super toxic. I don't, I don't even know what's there anymore. I mean, and plus, I got a fair amount of rage bait, right? Which, what does rage bait do? It brings out the haters. Lucas gives us a really hard time about our tendency to lean towards rage bait because I just love kind of being a troll and stirring the pot, right?

He's like, you need to have like reasonable, thoughtful, nuanced discourse to help bring the industry along. And my whole response to that is, Lucas, how long have we known each other? Have you ever known me to have reasonable, thoughtful, nuanced discourse? It's kind of your gig, dog. So does that mean you're going to start making walking videos? Walkie-talkies. Walkie-talkies. Yeah. I mean, some people say that I look like I probably need to get a little cardio Walkie-talkies uphill.

Terrible. Somebody told you that? Uphill both ways. Oh, honey. Have you ever been on the internet? Gosh. Kelly, you're too nice, man. She's a sweetie. You're too nice. So I will say that it is time for Summer Olympics Part 2. We're recording this one week before Tools in Pennsylvania. Last year at Tools— Well, you're not going this time, so nobody got to see what they chose.

I was 3 months into the shot, right? And I hate— one, I hate needles. And two, I had poop breath. I had sulfur breath was a thing. And so I stopped because my breath actually smelled like actual poop. Like clear a room type stuff. Yeah. And he was just sitting there eating the mints like— I was trying to eat like Altoids nonstop.

So it was like poop shit. Yeah. It was like curiously strong poop breath. You shit a peppermint. Yes, exactly. But now I'm on Wegovy this time, which is the pill, because I'm a baby and shots make me nervous. And so we'll see how that works. And I'm going to do hormone replacement therapy and get all raged up, and then I can record with David again and be like, "Rah!

I'm more angry than you are!" No, I don't know. Please don't. We have enough of that going on. Hey, so we're going to be in Cali. That was the most random conversation. And the whole time she's been worried to death. I don't know what to say. I won't know what to talk about. We're going to talk about her big life. I have been so nervous.

I've never been on a podcast. First time. No, weren't you? Wasn't the whole family on together one time? Yeah, she was in the background whenever we did the very first one. I was in there when y'all got on Jada McKennie. Whenever we did the very first one with Jeff. Yeah, I actually listened to that episode. That was a great episode. You guys all did great.

Just talking about the family. Talking about the family. A great family. I don't like You guys have the blueprint for a great family. We'll parent them when they little. You're gonna need to write a book. That's what you need to do. How to get shit done with the family. Like all kidding aside, when I came and sat in the Parnell class or the Limitless Leadership class that you had at the shop, it was obvious that you guys have like done it the right way.

Every family has issues, right? But your family actually likes each other, it would appear, for the most part, more often than not. Most of the time. Yeah, most of the time. And it's truly a family business, and the culture in your business appears to be incredible. And the community that you've built around the business, I mean, it was like, it was like some goals.

Yeah. Like, what, what's happened there? I mean, I don't know, you think Do you think that that's possible in like an urban, densely populated area? Or do you think that's a small town, like a small town existence? Oh, I think that's small town mentality, but you can bring that into the city. Well, but you got to remember, I've been in that community my whole life.

You know, people talk about you got to have this and you got to have that. Dude, I'm on a two-lane country road in the middle of a community called Frog Pond. Destination. I mean, we out in the sticks. There is a stop sign like a mile away. There's a stop sign down the road. Yeah. But, you know, we— the community has taken care of us, so we've always tried to take care of the community.

And it don't matter if it's the teacher appreciation or, you know, we're constantly doing something with different schools. I truly believe in that. I really do. I truly, truly believe in that. And that's shown through everything that we do. The people that, that are in the shop now, they love it. I mean, they love it. Our kids have grown up there. I've grown up there.

You know, I've told the story many times about me and Christy meeting in the little 2-bay service station. And that's literally a half a mile down the road from where my shop is now. Now, was Christy a customer? Mm-hmm. She was a customer. My wife was a customer. She actually started coming up there when she was like 12, 13 years old, she says.

And I never really noticed her then. Funny story, we met over a pair of boobs. Once she was driving, she was about— boobs, boobs, titties, titties, the tatas. Do tell. Well, she, she drove a little '88 Camaro and I had to go into the glove box to get a wheel key out of it or registration card or something like that. And there's a pair of fake boobs in the glove box and there's nobody there but me and her.

So I walk into the office and I've got her fake boobs in my hand. I said, hey, is there something you need to tell me? And I mean, we, we, you know, we had never really talked a whole lot. And she's like, yeah, get your hands off my boobs. I can hear that. Yep. And it was all love from there. It was love from there on.

That's a real love from first to 10. Like, how long have you had the shop though? So we opened in 2007. Okay. Well, let's back up just a little bit. So worked for a man in a two-bay service station, Avery Whitley. Worked for him from my 13th birthday. Started freshman year of high school working for him. Parents, I wanted a horse. Parents said, you want a horse?

Get a job. So I got a job sweeping the floors and wiping up tools at a little service station. And before I knew it, it was 17 years later and done married and kids and, and all that. Um, me and Christy got married in 1999, and at that time I was still working for Ave, but I would go here and work on your car, and I'd go there, and I'd go to this shop and that shop and driveways and out in my driveway or anywhere I could to make a living, man.

We had, we had kids to support. So, um, we built the first shop, which is a, a little Steel Master, like, Kwanzaa hut type deal. We put a little 30x32 up and our backyard. Could not afford concrete. I mean, all we had was the, the metal building with the back wall, and I had plastic hanging on the, the front wall. We had just enough concrete.

I had a 10x10 square pad of concrete in the back corner. That's where I changed the first engine at in that shop. The rest of it was just gravels. And as I got a little bit of money, I'd pour a little bit more concrete and a little bit more concrete, a little bit more concrete. The fact that you say that, as you got more money, then you start to pour patch by patch.

If you look at our driveway at our shop, that's how dad did it. Yeah. Yeah. I can't wait for you two to meet. I am so looking forward to that. I am so. So what I was getting at is we talked about your community and all the work that you do in the community and all that stuff. When did that become important to you?

Like, was that always in you? Because you're also a Boy Scout troop leader. Yes, ma'am. So service is in your blood. Mm-hmm. Has that always been a part of your business to be community focused? Yeah, yeah, it really has. It really has. Christy's been a teacher. She was a teacher forever. So always in the schools, it was always knew about this family that needed something or we're doing a project for the school here or whatever and we just wanted to be a part of it.

And I mean, it wasn't really something we set out to do. We just kind of did it because it needed to be done. So you can't be a shop owner, well, you probably could, but, and think, okay, I'm going to do it like he does. And it'll be fake. If you decide, oh, I want to be this, I want to do this for the community and you don't do it in the right way and it's not coming from your heart, I wonder if the results are going to be the same.

Yeah. Servant leadership. Yeah. People can tell. Dogs can tell if you're a good person or not. People can tell. Yeah, I get bit all the time. Maybe you're just hanging out with the wrong dogs. That may be it. So, Callie. So I've known you for years as Callie Grace, and now I noticed it's Callie. What was the choice in the change of the name?

I didn't really change it. Some people call me Callie Grace still, and some people call me Callie. So I just go with either. Like, if somebody calls either, I'm going to answer to it. How do you introduce yourself to a stranger? Typically just Callie. Okay. Yeah, typically. She's always my Callie Grace. Yeah. To people that I really like, I like them to call me Callie Grace.

Okay. But if it's like a stranger, typically it's just Callie. So for me, just Callie then. You can do either. She doesn't know about you yet. Like, Tanika calls you Callie Grace a lot. It's Callie Grace. Yeah. Well, it's probably because I've heard the two of you referencing her all this time, so I just assumed that's the way to go. So yeah, that's, that's Niecy.

But I was really sad when it's, it's not like Kelly Grace Burris anymore. Like when I see it on social media, yeah, I get a little— the email signature, congratulations, congratulations. I was like, she's, she's married and she changed her last name. It's not even my last name. Would you feel a little betrayed? I told Gage he was gonna have to be Gage Burris.

I know, right? He was gonna change Gage Burris. GB. I remember that. Yeah. She'll always be my Kelly Grace. And you guys have moved to Texas now, right? Yes. How is Texas so far? I love it. Do you really? Yeah, I love it. We're actually going to be moving again soon, which makes me both happy and sad at the same time because we've made a great friend group down there that are like our age, Marines.

They're great people. Their spouses are great. So I'm excited. I'm excited to see if we end up going to another country or staying in the United States. That'll be something neat. It's okay, Benji. Don't cry. He'll be overseas at least once in the first 4 years, right? There's a Potential for sure of that. What's up, guys? I was just coming to talk to you about one of my favorite pieces of software that we use in line with TechMetric, our point of sale system platform that we're using, and that is Detect Auto.

And you've heard me talk about Detect Auto for almost a year at this point. My team loves it. I enjoy it. It makes life easier. And I just want to talk to you about one of those features, and that is just their maintenance tool. If you know how time-consuming and tiring it can be to go back and search history one by one by one by one to get a picture —of a vehicle service history before you make your maintenance recommendations.

This is going to save an enormous amount of time. In 30 seconds or less, it's checking CARFAX service history, it's checking OEM service interval recommendations, and it's checking your own internal customized service interval recommendations. And it combines all that information to give you a picture of the maintenance that has been missed or is not known on that vehicle and adds those recommendations automatically to your inspection process.

With just a couple clicks of buttons, that can be added also directly into your repair order and your estimate. I think it's a great tool. It's a great time saver. I love it, and I think you will too. You should give it a shot. If you want to find out more, check out the link to Detect Auto in our show notes. So I remember the first time somebody told me about ChatGPT and I got really geeked out about it and I used it to write a poem for my wife and I thought that was the coolest thing ever.

And it's evolved a little bit in the last 18 months and now I I for one welcome our new AI overlords and can't wait to see how I can help them out. All kidding aside, Confessions is hosting a class on Saturday, June 13th. If you come down a night early, you can come to Friday Night Shenanigans on Friday the 12th. But it's a full-day class taught by Seth Thorson about how you can build your own AI agents and your own— build your own AI tools within your business to help make your business more efficient, more effective, more profitable.

This is an owner and manager only class. There are limited seats available for this class because it's very hands-on. You're going to need your Laptop, you're going to need an active subscription to the AI of your choice. I recommend ChatGPT and Claude AI. Early sign-up discount, it's $8.99. If you sign up after May 17th, it's $12.99. Tap the link in the show notes or scan the QR code on your screen to learn more.

It's going to be awesome. I'm trying to get prepared because I feel like she's going to wind up in Okinawa. Yeah, I will be honest, I talk about wanting to gauge because when you're first married, there's not a requirement to move overseas, but if you request it, it is 100% accepted because they people to go overseas and a lot of people don't want to go overseas.

But I've encouraged Gage for the experience of it to go overseas to like Okinawa, Japan or Italy, Norway. Because I mean, when are you ever going to be able to move to another country on your own dime? Whereas this one you're moving on the military and we don't have children yet. So you're doing it right. My brother was stationed in Okinawa twice and he loved it.

Yeah. Everybody that we've talked to has loved it. I'm encouraging her very much, even though dad don't want to see her go. They make airplanes. Dude, take off. Yeah. You got no kids. You got nothing here to tie you down. It's a big, beautiful world we live in. Go see it. Yeah, go see it. Go enjoy it. Yeah. Frog Pond will be here when you get back.

Meet interesting new people and kill them. Yeah, right. Great. You just get to meet interesting new people. Yeah. Yeah. I love meeting people. The Marines job. She don't hurt a stranger. So Callie will make friends no matter where she goes. She'll be fine no matter where she goes. Where'd she get that from? Her mama. That is not true. That's a lie, Drew.

That comes from you. That is not true. Huh? Yeah. I was like, that comes from you. Yeah, it for sure comes from you. Yeah. We don't know strangers. We don't know strangers. I love it. Go back and you, you mentioned that you're heavily involved with the schools and kind of partnering between Frog Pond and the schools. What, what do you do there?

For example, Teacher Appreciation Week's coming up in what, about 3 more weeks, I think? Something like that. We will— first week of May. Okay, so we will literally— we don't just go and buy pizzas or whatever. Christy will cook lasagnas or whatever. She will cook, and we go up and we serve the teachers. You know, we don't just go up and drop it off and say, thank y'all very much, and leave a business card there.

We go in and we serve the teachers as they come through. Now, you can't cook for students, But the, the teachers, yeah, they don't care. They'll eat anything. So yeah, you know, just that kind of stuff. And, and it don't matter if it's football team, baseball, basketball, cheerleading. You know, Callie Grace was in cheerleading forever, so we would constantly do something for the different athletes, whatever they needed.

And, and the schools know the businesses that they can depend on, that they can they reach out to. And we get a list all the time. Girl Scout troops, Boy Scout troops, just anything that involves community outreach, anything we can do in the community. So I think what's important there is what you're talking about is not just writing a check. Yeah. No, writing a check is nice too, right?

They need that, but they need boots on the ground. Giving of your, of your time and your attention makes a big difference too. And I think that's the difference between —what we were talking about earlier about how people can tell. Like, they're appreciative if you write the check. Sure. But if you show up and you're the hands and feet of Jesus, right, or of whatever you're trying to do community-wise, that makes a big difference.

So, but again, that community is taking care of us. Yeah. Yeah. It's because of them that we went from a 30 by 32 Steelmaster building with gravel on the floor to a 6,000 square foot shop that, you know, I can leave now. I think that you probably are a contributing factor to Lucas Underwood's struggles because he saw your shop and he was like, ooh, I want a shop like that.

And he bit off more than he can chew. And now he's like, what the hell am I going to do? Why you talk about that man when he is not here to defend himself? Because that's the most fun time to talk about him. Oh, okay. You're right. So I know where you're located. It's not too far from Charlotte. And the community has been what it's been.

Uh, I lived there around '95. That's how we got to talking, because she's like, there's no way that you know. I was like, I do. Like, literally my aunt's house is probably less than 5 miles from your home. It has grown so much. It is. And a lot of those people are people that have just been running away from Mecklenburg County. Transplants.

Transplants. Do you have How do you deal with that? How do you deal with the big city folk coming in and demanding certain things, certain way, they just don't know how it's done, and what's that Montgomery County? Yeah, well, like, how do you train that customer? Here's the thing, when you come into our shop, you don't demand what we do because it just won't work.

You know, we got, we do things our way and there's a reason we do it like that. And I've had some pretty tough conversations with with customers who say, you're trying to work on my vehicle your way and I want it done my way. I'm sorry, that doesn't work here. You know, I want just the pads replaced. I don't want the rotors turned or replaced or whatever.

Sorry, dude. Yeah. People in here don't like me. There's a lot of other shops around. Carry on. Just put on chains. I don't need tensioners and guides. Just put the chains on. Yeah. Yeah. And then buy me a new engine when it blows up. So, um, I do want to talk a little bit about Callie's new job. I love it. Yeah, I love it so much.

It's been a really good change. I've got to meet a ton of new people, which has been great. I think people like what I'm doing, or I hope at least they do. I've got good feedback. So, well, you knew a lot of the kind of core people already just through Frog Pond, right? And through coming to ASTA Expo as an attendee for years and a volunteer.

So tell everyone, what is your new gig? I am the membership and events manager for the ASTA, and I'm loving it so much. And I'm going into my— this will be my third expo to attend. I remember Dad talked about it a lot. How many years have you gone? You've gone— I don't even know at this point, but you invited me 3 years ago and I went.

I was nervous. I did not know what to expect, and I didn't hardly know anybody. I had just started like I was just in the very start of doing your social media. And so I was like, oh, these people are going to be older than me. They're going to be really smart. They're probably going to think I'm silly because I'm so young.

Because I was only older, not smart. Because I was still in high school at that point. And it was so much fun. I mean, I got to meet some people and I got out of my shell. I talked to a lot of people. That's when I got to meet— What shell? I kind of had a shell back then a little bit. Come on now.

Well, maybe a little, but last year was awesome. That was when I really branched out and talked to just as many people as I could. I mean, I made so many friends there and I still text them and shop owners too. It's just great. How many, uh, how many people reach out to you on a, on a weekly basis saying, hey, will you do my social media?

I got one this morning actually. I'll be damned. I got one this morning. I've thought about it multiple times and I was like, she's got too much stuff going on to mess with my mess. I've had several friends say, hey, would Callie Grace be interested in doing this? For the low, low price of— I know, too. Yeah, absolutely. 100%. But I like the fact that, um, so you got two boys, you got a girl.

Cody's working in the shop. She's working in the shop. Other baby's just playing, um, what, Yogi the Bear? He gets paid to go out and scout for where he's going hunting. That's what I tell him all the time. He works for the state of Oklahoma. He's a park ranger. Yeah. But As a young lady in the automotive industry, how do you feel fitting in?

Like, does you have no qualms, no problems, no issues? Just you, you don't. You just fit into any room. Like, how do you feel about young women in the industry? I think it's a great thing. I love it. I mean, I personally, and I think it helps because I talk to everybody, but I don't really feel like I have a problem fitting in a room.

And I love that saying, why fit in when you're born to stand out? Yeah, it's one of my favorite sayings, and I really believe in that. So if I walk into a room, I want to just talk to everybody and kind of make my mark. So I'd like to view life like that. I can't wait till this year. Now that she's got this new job with the ASTA.

Mm-hmm. You wait till the next show coming up. She will be in everyone's face with cameras and questions and I can see it now. Yeah, well, we need that kind of engagement. It's going to be a busy, busy, busy week for you. Yes. But I'm very excited and I've came up with all kinds of video ideas. Videos already that I'm plotting out for it.

Uh-oh. And I got— I can work with my smile and talk people into doing videos. So I'm really hoping I can just— all kinds of strangers and people I've never met before, hopefully I can get them in videos too because I want to branch out and meet new people there. Well, I mean, it was what, like 1,200, 1,300 people there last year?

Uh, so I think there'll probably be 1,500 or 1,600 people there this year. So be a lot of opportunities to meet folks. Yeah, no doubt. I think it's the best networking event in the industry. Like, it's not the biggest, obviously, but at a certain point you get so big that it's impossible to have the opportunity to network with everyone. But with the, the social events that happened before and during and after, um, Casino Night, um, the spectacular hospitality suite, um, I mean, it's just, there's so much opportunity to find the people that you want to connect with and you have multiple chances to make that connection and build relationships.

And from a vendor perspective, I mean, there are vendors that show up just in time to set their booth up and they stand at their booth awkwardly and then they leave. And they're like, I didn't get anything from ASC Expo. You get out of it what you put into it. Come to the pizza party, come to casino night, go to the pre-party.

Yeah, the pre-party last year was insane. Yeah, I mean, that was like— That was amazing. That was a lot of fun. Yeah. And then shop owners that look from the outside in, they're looking at our social media and they haven't come to the expo yet and then they're afraid to come because someone said that it kind of looks cliquey. It's not. It's not.

It is the least cliquey event. I mean, unless you want to consider 1,200 people a clique. Yeah. 1,200 people clique. Because we all clique. Yeah. We have a great time. Like there's a spot for everybody. Yeah. There's everybody, any shop owner, multiple shop owner, new shop owner, still mobile guy, still doing what you did in the beginning, whatever stage you're at in your business.

There's something for everybody. Yeah. I was, there's a dude here who's at Fueling Connections today and he was in this room because like at 7:50 this morning they were sending people down here instead of the auditorium by accident. That's how I came in. Started talking. He's like, you don't remember me, but we met at the expo last year. And he was a technician who was a high-volume, high-hour-producing technician, was making a lot of money.

And he said, you know, the conversation that we had last year had a significant impact on me, and I'm no longer a wrench. He's a service director. And he— the conversation that we had with him led him to change his career. Well, look at us. And I'm like, I'm like, dude, I don't even remember you, dog. But it does feel like it gets overwhelming sometimes.

But here's the deal. You're going to meet hundreds of people, but the conversations that are had, it's like there's no disrespect meant in the fact that I don't remember this guy. It's just one of 40 conversations you have that day, right? Can be impactful on others and on yourself. Because I've had conversations at the expo before that had a major impact on the direction that I went in my business and in my life..

And it's neat to know that we're having those conversations now that are having an impact. And the dude, he's here getting leadership training because he's now in a leadership role. He went from a technical role to a leadership role. He thought he wanted to own and open his own shop, and he went to Dutch's class about for technicians that are wanting to own and open their own shop.

He said, you know what, I don't want that. Yeah, I want to be in leadership for somebody else's shop. And so, I mean, there's something for everybody, that event, for any position in the shop and for any position you want to be holding in the future.. And I thought that was a pretty cool conversation that just happened this morning. I remember those conversations.

I mean, that's the AST, the first one. That was, that was my game changer. I remember that very distinctively because although my guys don't really believe me, there was a time when I actually had to turn the wrenches and answer the phones and, and do it all. And, and it was that first expo that was back when it was still IGO. That made all the difference in the world.

And it was those conversations, that's where I first met Rick White and, you know, really got to talk to Lucas. And so many people had such an impact. When I first opened my shop, I thought my old systems would keep up. The software that I had would continue to evolve. But as we grew, the slow estimates, scattered workflow, increasing downtime, it really just, it was becoming a real problem.

That's why I switched to TechMetric. It's not just software. It's a complete shop management system that makes my life easier. SmartJobs, instant estimates, integrated payments, integrated financing options. I mean, it allows me to focus on the work that actually makes me money and not get bogged down in the other details. My shop's repair orders have jumped over 300% since switching to TechMetric.

And when I need help, their support team responds in real time. I actually was online with them asking questions just this week, and I got answers in minutes rather than having to wait for callbacks and emails days later. If your system is holding you back, it's time for a change. Tap the link in the show notes and see how TechMetric can help you move your shop forward.

Dude, there's got to be a better way. And I found that way. There's a lot of better ways. I found it at the ASCA. Same, same for me. Like you, you went with your father because your dad used to be a part of it too. Dad was a board member in the '90s. Um, and I remember going to one where there was like 50 people, right?

Wow. And there were as many people there manning the booths as there were attendees. And there are shows like that happening all over the country and have been. And I think one of the things that's different about what is now ASTA— it was IGO at the time— is the energy that other people put back into it. And I think they developed a community and a networking environment where it was like, we are not competitors.

There are more cars driving by the bay of the front door of my shop than I can possibly work on, right? And we don't have to be enemies. We can share best practices. We can lean on each other for help and advice. My second store is downtown Raleigh and literally boom, boom, boom, it's 3 stores. The back wall of my shop, if somebody runs through the parking lot in his shop, it's going to run through the back wall of my shop.

And there's 3 of those. Uh, it's King's Automotive, former IGO president, uh, longtime board member, current ASTA member. They come to the expo every year. It's Car Fix, and then it's Piper's Automotive, former board president. I mean, and it's like when I went to look at that building, I walked next door to each of them, said, hey guys, y'all cool with me moving in right here?

And like, yeah, if I lose any customers to you, it's my fault. Yep. Great. And we help each other. Yeah. And that's, I think, what is unique about being a member of ASTA. And now we started as a, as a just a North Carolina kind of thing, right? But now it's really become Southeastern US and national and international because we've got We've got Canadians coming in, we've got Australians coming in, we've got people coming in from the British Isles.

And I just— seeing the growth while maintaining that small town feel and the everybody's here to help everybody has been pretty awesome. So I'm excited about that. I'm excited about that too. So Callie, don't screw this up. No pressure. No pressure. No pressure. You got this. I hope not. That'll be bad. No, it's fine. You're going to do awesome. I think you're going to do awesome.

So I appreciate that. Thank you. Um, what can we expect in 2026 Expo? Any, any, uh, new exciting things that we should be aware of? Keep it all under wraps. That's what I was about to say. We're just going to kind of drip it out a little bit at a time on the socials, kind of build up the excitement. You're saying if I'd actually made it to the board meeting yesterday, I would know?

Since I didn't make it to the board meeting, Yeah, come on, we don't got to release this episode now. No, this has got to be released ASAP so people know and get ready. I do have a question. When do I have to write the check for the hospitality suite? Yesterday, that's the deadline. Waiting on you. Um, it's going to be cool. We're not in the same space as last year.

How did you do that? Are they letting you bring alcoholic beverages in? Um, because it's the bar. I don't think we talk about that openly and publicly. We're just gonna It just kind of happens. We're just going to relax and let it happen. Okay. Oh, uh, I saw nothing. That's my mantra for life. Um, no, I think it'd be great. And they said that I can bring in all the arcade games and the poker table and everything again.

Really? That'd be fun. I don't think there's enough, uh, the way the space lays out, I'm not going to bring all the couches and stuff again this time because while it was a super cool space last year, it was so full of people. It was crowded. Yeah, it was crowded. It was so much fun though. But you got to bring the throne.

The throne must Oh, the throne will be there, dog. So I kind of want like one of those really gaudy, obnoxious gold thrones with the big red velvet cushions. Is that velvet? You should do that and then add like an LED backlight behind it. This red. Do not give this fool any more ideas. So it would glow like if you're sitting in the chair, red all around.

That would be so cool. That'd be kind of like the throne that I got the picture of your mom in. Yeah. In the speakeasy in Mexico the other night. Did I send you that picture? I don't think so. You should try it. I keep aviator sunglasses with me at almost all times now in case I happen to walk by a throne so that I can have a picture of me with glasses and a whiskey glass.

You need a Game of Thrones throne with the knives in it from the Game of Thrones. It's very violent. I'm a lover, not a hater. Just because you can't fight. That's also a part of it. There's way too much full-frontal male nudity in that show for me. Way too many balls. Yeah, man. A lot of balls. It just made your balls feel small.

Is that why you— Bobby, because there's like 3 pair of balls in that whole show. I'm very, I'm very in touch with my balls. Thanks. Oh, we know. There's lots of stories. They keep coming out. They keep coming out. What is happening? Are you talking about the balls or the stories? Both. No, I can keep my balls nicely tucked away now. Thanks.

Now. Now you wear tighty whities. What? You know, I— we just set up— You definitely don't listen to the podcast, do you? There's a story about my balls that happens. You'll have that. We set up the sign-up page for the Seth Dawson class on AI that we're doing in June. And there's a series of questions like, you know, name, address, phone number, yada yada yada.

And one of them is boxers or briefs. So we'll see what the people who— or commando. No, I think you get to a certain stage in life and you learn not to go commando anymore. You know, we'll talk about that off camera. We don't, we don't have to talk about that at all. I feel like, yeah, I feel like we've already had a conversation about that on camera once.

Oh my God. Um, so Poor Callie doesn't know what the hell's going on. Yeah, she's just over there like, what's happening? Hey, can we, can we talk about the, uh, the Flying with the Eagles that's coming up? Flying with the Eagles? Yeah. I am going to miss that, and I really wish, because my 20 group meets at the same time, um, but I really— you should switch coaching companies.

Oh my God, but I really wanted to. Mike, you gonna be there? Um, what dates are they? I need to go again because I've gone twice over the years, but it's a totally new curriculum now that Matt and Joe are running. Is it like the second week back from Tools maybe? I think so. I think so. It's coming up quick. It's coming up quick.

I'm thinking very seriously about sending both of my guys up front. And the reason I want to go so bad is because I really enjoyed you and Matt's coaching. Those are the best. Those are the only ones that I listen to. It's May 14th through the 16th. Yeah. Charlotte. Matt is really good. He's really good. Homie is smart. Well, what's your problem?

Why can't you take directions? Um, it's because I think I know everything. So here's the thing, right? Maybe I should be a coach because I've been to all the classes and I know all the right things to say. I just totally fail on implementation. Yeah. I fail on implementation and accountability. But you also go to a lot of UNC games. And you should not be playing.

You should just be like— you just say you went to all the classes and so you should be a coach. That's like saying I went to all the games and I should be a player. Those who can do, those who can't coach, right? Teach? No, I don't know. We're doing a class at the Expo. You realize that you're talking people out of taking our class at the Expo?

No, they're coming to see me. Oh, they're not coming to see you. Otis, you too is doing a class. And Lucas, the three of us. Oh, that'd be good. Oh my. That'd be good. Owners only. Oh my. No sponsors, no coaches. Well, you know I'm gonna be in there. No. Unless you're there for AV purposes. No, he's gonna be there for AV.

He's gonna be walking around with a microphone. He's gonna be Vanna White. You have to wear a ball gown. Sequins. Okay. Braxton. Go ahead and let your hair grow out. It's happening. I feel like Braxton is probably a drag queen. Like once a month, every third Wednesday. What is his name? What would be your drag queen name? Braxtina. Braxtina. He doesn't have a mic.

Nobody can hear him. Braxtina. He agrees. We have a small problem. We got a small problem. I'm testing Ryan about it. We got the caterers out front. Okay. And they're— Callie Grace is trying to get ahold of Ryan so somebody can go out there and pick up the food. I mean, we can go. How long we been talking? 40 minutes. Yeah. I mean, ASTA Expo, September 24th through 26th.

Come down early. Come visit Brown's Automotive. Come visit Car Fix. Come visit the Car Fix Confessions of a Shop Owner Bar and Lounge. astaexpo.com or astausa.org. You can find us on social media. All of it. Yeah. Like, follow for more and wear underwear. Come see what all the hoopla is about. Please. Yeah, you won't regret it. Yeah. And if you think you're coming by yourself, you're not.

Come find me. Yeah, come find us. Come chill. Yes. Yeah, we'll be there. We don't bite. Love, peace, and hair grease. We gotta go get food. Love you. Love, peace, and hair grease. Thanks for listening to Confessions of a Shop Owner, where we lay it all out— the good, the bad, and sometimes the super messed up. I'm your host, Mike Allen, here to remind you that even the pros screw it up sometimes.

So why not laugh a little bit, Learn a little bit and maybe have another drink. You got a confession of your own or a topic you'd like me to cover? Or do you just want to let me know what an idiot I am? Email mike@confessionsofashopowner.com or call and leave a message. The number is 704-CONFESS. That's 704-266-3377. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to like, subscribe, or follow.

Join us on this crazy journey that is shop ownership. I'll see you on the next episode. All right, guys. AI class. Learn how to use AI so that you can make it your bitch and you don't become its bitch. Saturday, June 13th, Seth Thorson's teaching a full-day class in Raleigh, North Carolina. Tap the link in the show notes or scan the QR code on your screen to learn more.

It's going to be awesome.

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Confessions of a Shop OwnerOctober 27 · 1h 5m

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Confessions of a Shop OwnerOctober 23 · 48 min

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Tekmetric transformed my shop. Plain and simple. Want that for yours? Touch HEREIf you're like me and aren't good at marketing, don't do it on your own. Let the experts handle it. Touch HERE for more on Turnkey Marketing.47 Consultants brings your shop’s story to life on social media, helping Carfix engage 60,000 people in Raleigh in just a few weeks. See what 47 Consultants can do for your shop, and tell them Big Daddy Mike sent you!Elite Worldwide's Ignite 2027 is coming up in February and NOW is the time to sign up. It's happening in Vegas February 4-6 and it will be the best 3 days of your shops year when you attend. Save $100 when you use code CONFESSIONS HERE When I used the maintenance tool for the fist time with Detect Auto, my mind was blown. My advisors had the same reaction - and then SO MUCH MORE TIME. Learn more about Detect Auto and book a free demo now!Mike Allen and Bryan Pollock welcome Caleb McElmurry to talk about the realities of building a repair business when you’re still the technician, service advisor, estimator, parts department and owner all at once. Caleb started mobile, moved several hours away and essentially started over with a brick-and-mortar shop—and now he’s intentionally waiting until the business is consistently ready before hiring his first technician. They debate why hiring a cheap apprentice first can actually make a solo owner less productive, how many billable hours might signal that it’s time to hire, what types of jobs a startup shop should avoid and why some European cars can eat a new shop alive. Caleb also explains why his first major training event is focused almost entirely on business and service-advisor skills instead of technical classes, and the conversation turns into ASE certifications, technician licensing, customer communication, $1,000 AROs and why owners shouldn’t go home from training and try to change their entire business Monday morning. The bigger lesson: being great at fixing cars gets you started—but learning how to run the business is what determines what happens next.Timestamps: 00:00 – Why Startup Shops Should Be Careful With European Cars05:13 – Meet Caleb McElmurry06:01 – From Mobile Mechanic to Brick-and-Mortar07:09 – When Should Caleb Hire His First Technician?09:22 – Why Your First Hire Shouldn’t Be Cheap Labor10:05 – How Busy Should a Solo Shop Be?13:00 – Tow Trucks, Winter & Small-Town Shop Life16:00 – Stop Giving Jobs the “Go Away” Price20:29 – First Training Event: Don’t Implement Everything23:00 – Why Caleb Isn’t Taking Technical Classes25:00 – Should Automotive Technicians Be Licensed?30:00 – ASE, Apprenticeships & Industry Standards33:00 – Just Get 1% Better34:00 – Caleb’s Service Advisor Process36:42 – Do Customers Need Prices Explained First?38:00 – A $1,000 ARO in a One-Man Shop39:00 – Caleb’s Plan for His First Technician41:12 – The Difficulty of Turning the Business Off43:13 – Late Nights at ASTA

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Confessions of a Shop OwnerOctober 20 · 55 min

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Keep shop management, payments, marketing (all the things) all in one place with Tekmetric. It will CHANGE YOUR LIFE. Click HERETurnkey Marketing has made my life SOOO much simpler, AND they've helped keep the phone ringing. Do you need these two things too? Learn more HERE47 Consultants brings your shop’s story to life on social media, helping Carfix engage 60,000 people in Raleigh in just a few weeks. See what 47 Consultants can do for your shop, and tell them Big Daddy Mike sent you!When I used the maintenance tool for the fist time with Detect Auto, my mind was blown. My advisors had the same reaction - and then SO MUCH MORE TIME. Learn more about Detect Auto and book a free demo now!Elite Worldwide's Ignite 2027 is coming up in February and NOW is the time to sign up. It's happening in Vegas February 4-6 and it will be the best 3 days of your shops year when you attend. Save $100 when you use code CONFESSIONS HEREMike Allen sits down with Trey and Sasha Holley, owners of a 10-bay repair shop in Thomaston, Georgia, for a conversation about growth, technician development, working with your spouse and building a business that can eventually survive without you. Trey and Sasha share how losing Sasha’s father suddenly forced them into the business side of automotive before they were ready—and why watching him work himself relentlessly shaped the kind of shop they want to build today. They also explain why struggling to find an experienced A-tech completely changed their hiring philosophy after they took a chance on a high-school student, bought him a toolbox and developed him into a productive young technician now learning diagnostics. The conversation gets into their 400-hour backlog, whether becoming a multi-shop operation is actually something they want, succession planning for their son and the uncomfortable question of what happens to your business if you die tomorrow. And in true Confessions fashion, Trey eventually admits that one of his shop’s biggest historical problems wasn’t employees, technicians or customers—it was his own attitude.Timestamps: 00:00 – Do You Really Need an A-Tech?01:29 – Meet Trey & Sasha Holley03:59 – From Two Bays to a 10-Bay Shop05:38 – Being Thrown Into Business Overnight06:15 – Losing Sasha’s Dad at 5108:57 – Starting Their Own Shop11:02 – Running a Business With Your Spouse13:03 – When Employees Play Husband vs. Wife16:40 – Moving a Technician Into the Front Office18:17 – 400 Hours of Approved Work19:27 – Stop Looking for A-Techs—Build Them20:50 – Teaching a Young Technician Diagnostics22:49 – The Never-Ending Growth Problem23:56 – How Much Growth Is Enough?25:39 – Building a Shop Their Son Can Inherit26:08 – What Happens If the Owners Die Tomorrow?28:36 – Mike’s “Oh Shit, I’m Dead” Book35:08 – What Happened to Sasha’s Dad’s Shop?38:04 – Their First ASTA Expo47:03 – Stop Making Excuses and Show Up51:09 – Trey’s Confession: “The Problem Was Me”52:44 – “I’ve Only Had Two Leave in Tears” 😂

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Confessions of a Shop OwnerOctober 16 · 1h 2m

Ep 121 - Marketing Call #2 | Are Your Advisors Accidentally Turning Customers Away?

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Remarkable Results RadioSeptember 8 · 32 min

The Power of Financing: A Growth Tool for Auto Repair Shops [RR 1108]

Thanks to our Partners, NAPA Auto Care and NAPA TRACS Watch Full Video Episode What happens when a customer needs a $2,000 repair but doesn’t have the cash available today? That moment can determine whether the vehicle gets repaired, the customer delays a critical service, or they take their business somewhere else. For automotive shops, offering flexible payment options can be more than a convenience. It can be a powerful tool for helping customers say yes to the work their vehicles need. Kwane Stokes, Assistant Vice President and Relationship Manager in the automotive division at Synchrony, explains how the program can help shops remove financial barriers, increase repair opportunities, and create another reason for customers to return. Kwane also addresses why many shops still aren't offering financing and how the biggest obstacle may simply be the assumptions advisors make about a customer's ability or willingness to pay. What You'll Learn Why financing should be presented as a payment option, not something an advisor decides a customer needs.How the program's average first and repeat purchase amounts demonstrate the potential impact on average repair order (ARO).Why assuming a customer can't qualify for credit can cause shops to lose needed repair work.How monthly promotional offers can give shops another reason to communicate with their customers.How advisor incentives and simple training can encourage more consistent presentation of financing.What the upcoming "waterfall" financing model could mean for customers who aren't approved through the primary credit program. The biggest opportunity may not be finding more customers. It may be giving the customers already sitting at your counter more ways to say yes. The key is removing the assumption that you know what a customer can or cannot afford. Present the options, explain them clearly, and let the customer decide what works for their financial situation. For a shop, financing isn't simply about collecting payment. It's another tool for helping customers get the repairs they need while protecting the relationship and keeping the work in your shop. Kwane Stokes, AVP, Relationship Manager, Auto Network, Synchrony Learn more about the benefits of being part of the NAPA family by visiting https://www.napaonline.com/en/auto-care NAPA TRACS will move your shop into the SMS fast lane with on-site training and six days a week of support: http://napatracs.com/ Connect with the Podcast: Download Our Mobile App:https://automotiverepairpodcastnetwork.com/app/Website:https://remarkableresults.biz/YouTube:https://www.youtube.com/carmcapriottoFacebook:https://www.facebook.com/RemarkableResultsRadioPodcast/LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/carmcapriotto/Instagram:https://www.instagram.com/remarkableresultsradiopodcast/Join Our Virtual Toastmasters Club:https://remarkableresults.biz/toastmastersJoin Our Private Facebook Community:https://www.facebook.com/groups/1734687266778976Join our Insider List:https://remarkableresults.biz/insiderBooks Page:https://remarkableresults.biz/booksOur Classroom Page:https://remarkableresults.biz/classroomEpisode Collections:https://remarkableresults.biz/collectionsBuy Me a Coffee:https://www.buymeacoffee.com/carm The Automotive Repair Podcast Network: https://automotiverepairpodcastnetwork.com/ Remarkable Results Radio Podcastwith Carm Capriotto:https://remarkableresults.biz/Automotive Field TheorywithMatt Fanslow:https://mattfanslow.captivate.fm/Business by the NumberswithHunt Demarest: https://huntdemarest.captivate.fm/The Auto Repair Marketing Podcastwith Brian and Kim Walker: https://autorepairmarketing.captivate.fm/The Weekly Blitzwith Chris Cotton: https://chriscotton.captivate.fm/Speak Up! Effective Communicationwith Craig O'Neill: https://craigoneill.captivate.fm                                        

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Repair Shop ReckoningJune 5 · 1h 11m

Prepare to Deliver: What Smart Owners Do During Slow Times

In this episode of Repair Shop Reckoning, Kevin tackles a reality every shop owner will face sooner or later: What do you do when the phones slow down, the bays aren't as full, and the panic starts creeping in? Too many owners react by cutting...

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Master Tech to MillionaireJune 1 · 47 min

Profit Panel: How 3 Shops Put $750K+ to the Bottom Line in One Month - Bonus Zoom Episode 7

Glenn Piccolo hosts the Profit Panel: Charlie Zlatkos, J.J. Mont and Lynn Massengill to reveal how auto hospitality, mindset shifts, pricing strategy, parts purchasing and execution drove dramatic profit gains across varied markets—from rural Tennessee to rust-heavy Boston. The episode shares real results, practical tactics (rack attack, key-to-key, follow-ups, part-shopping) and leadership lessons you can apply to increase net profit and transform your shop.   autoshopanswers.com auto-shop-media.com

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The Institute's Leading Edge PodcastSeptember 9 · 55 min

218 - What Your Opt-Outs Reveal: Your CRM Isn't Broken. It's Being Misused

218 - What Your Opt-Outs Reveal: Your CRM Isn't Broken. It's Being Misused September 9th, 2026 - 00:55:22 Show Summary: Most CRM systems are capable of producing results but the way shops use them can weaken customer relationships. Mass messages often focus on filling bays instead of delivering value customers actually want. Strong retention starts by understanding communication preferences and earning permission before sending messages. Shops can build stronger relationships by creating meaningful reasons for customers to stay connected. Automation can support that process but it should never replace genuine human communication. Returning customers should become a primary measure of success because lifetime value matters far more than a single repair order. A retention focused culture can create steadier car count and stronger long term growth.   Host(s): Jimmy Lea, VP of Business Development   Guest(s): Craig O'Neill, VP of Training Autoflow   Show Highlights:   [00:02:45] – CRM systems work but shops often misuse their capabilities. [00:06:32] – Mass text blasts can create opt outs instead of appointments. [00:12:10] – Effective communication must focus on what matters to customers. [00:18:18] – Customer retention should create meaningful relationships built on trust. [00:21:08] – Customers should understand why your messages provide real value. [00:27:36] – Promotional mass texts require proper permission before being sent. [00:33:28] – Retention should become a goal across the entire organization. [00:35:02] – Returning customers can reveal more than traditional sales metrics. [00:41:12] – Give customers a compelling reason to return after every visit. [00:45:35] – Safe reliable vehicles provide a powerful purpose for follow up.   In every business journey, there are defining moments or challenges that build resilience and milestones that fuel growth. We’d love to hear about yours! What lessons, breakthroughs, or pivotal experiences have shaped your path in the automotive industry? Share your story with us at info@wearetheinstitute.com, and you might be featured in an upcoming episode. 👉 Unlock the full experience - watch the full webinar on YouTube: https://youtu.be/10RC8L1nKhM   Don’t miss exclusive insights, expert takeaways, and real talk you won’t hear anywhere else. Hit Subscribe, drop a comment, and share it with someone who needs to hear this!   Links & Resources:  Want to learn more? Click Here Want a complimentary business health report? Click Here See The Institute's events list: Click Here Want access to our online classes? Click Here ________________________________________ Episode Transcript Disclaimer This transcript was generated using artificial intelligence and may contain errors. If you notice any inaccuracies, please contact us at marketing@wearetheinstitute.com.   Episode Transcript: Jimmy Lea: Hello, welcome. Glad to be with you today. It is Wednesday, so excited for Webinar Wednesday. Coming to you live from the road. I'm in Eugene, Oregon, here at Brian Slater's shop in Eugene, Oregon. This is the North Eugene Auto Repair in in Eugene, and so coming to you from the road. Thank you, Brian. Jimmy Lea: Appreciate you letting me use your office today as we're out and about visiting shops. It's just an awesome, gorgeous weather here in northern U- northern... no. I was gonna say northern Utah. I'm not in northern Utah. I'm in Eugene, Oregon, and this is not northern Utah, but it is gorgeous weather. Jimmy Lea: So if you don't have gorgeous weather where you are, you wish you were here. We're gonna have a great conversation today. Those of you who have comments, questions, comments, put them into the chat section. That chat section comments allows us to have this conversation back and forth. I will be the voice for You've got questions, comments, concerns for our guest, want to make sure that those are voiced for you, put them in the comments section. Jimmy Lea: My guest with us today is ever-present, ever-linguist, Mr. Craig O'Neill of AutoFlow. Craig, how the heck are you, brother? Craig O'Neill: I'm really good, Jimmy. Really good. I was actually thinking northern Utah, as you mentioned Utah, even though it was Oregon. Both places are beautiful. I can't blame you for the distinction issue there. Craig O'Neill: That was- that's all right. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Yeah. No it is absolutely gorgeous up here. Now, I will tell you that there is a large lack of mountains in Eugene, Oregon- ... Jimmy Lea: That northern Utah does have, is bounteous mountains. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. A lot of them. Yeah. I can't wait. Ogden, a couple, next month. Next month now is October. Jimmy Lea: Yes. October for the Mars Conference. Craig O'Neill: Yep. Jimmy Lea: Yes. Yes. Speaking of Mars Conferences we're gonna put up a QR code for the Mars Conference. If you scan this QR code, it will get you right onto our registration page, and those sticking around to the very end, there is this very special, very unique offer for anybody who wants to attend the Mars Conference. Jimmy Lea: So stick around, scan the QR code. Save that in your smartphones. We are gonna have a great conversation about marketing. Craig is one of our presenters at the Mars Conference, and super excited for Craig to be here. Craig and I have known each other for a couple of years now, and worked together at a couple of companies, and- Jimmy Lea: glad that we are able to still be friends here in this wonderful industry that we call home. Craig, what are we talking about today? Craig O'Neill: Jimmy, this is the, one of my favorite topics to go into. We're talking about CRM systems, of course. Now I have some opinions about CRM systems. Both of us come from a background that deals in these systems. Craig O'Neill: You have opinions as well, and you have some observations, and my observation is simply this: the systems themselves are capable of some pretty cool things- Jimmy Lea: Yeah ... Craig O'Neill: but we aren't using them very well. The it's not broken, they're being misused, is the title of our conversation today. Your CRM isn't broken, it's being misused. Craig O'Neill: And I don't like to walk into a conversation with "Oh, you're doing something wrong", or on the opposite side of it, I don't like to walk into a conversation as you guys are doing it right. You're just fine, but other people are doing it..." Like I, I've used stuff wrong. I've made mistakes in how I leverage the different systems and tools that are available, and I just believe, and I hope you just go along with us today, there might be a better way than our way that we're approaching it now. Craig O'Neill: Be open to that. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Be open to it, because what they're, what you as a shop may be doing today is working. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. It's not even a debate. It is getting results of a certain level and type that are appearing to be adequate. Jimmy Lea: Adequate for today. And hopefully with this conversation that you and I are gonna have as we talk about the customer relationship management software Hopefully there's something we can expose shops to that might say, "Hey, maybe there is a different way of doing this." Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: So what are these ways? What are the five mistakes that shops make the most, or not the mistakes. What, how can we help these shops improve? Sure. I would call Craig O'Neill: them hurdles that we have to get over, right? Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Yeah. This one it's an opportunity for us to make it better. It's an opportunity to make it better. Jimmy Lea: This is what it is. It's not a mistake. You're not doing it wrong. Consider this. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. We're gonna talk about a lot of things on this, and I think before we even get into those hurdles, let's talk about the nature of communication today. Yeah. People's attention span today, because I think that there's a couple of different things that we need to understand. Craig O'Neill: And first off, let's talk about why we even wanna leverage a CRM system. And for many shops, you might have a sustainable s- sort of automatic practice here, but when you're a busy shop, you feel very successful, and then all of a sudden things are not as busy as they are. This happens to all of us. All the time. Craig O'Neill: We've ... shop, Jimmy, our transmission shop, family business that I came up, down into grew up in, and like we never had a slow spell. The shops around us always had those little slow spells, and we're like, "Yeah, we don't." And that was a good feeling until it happened to us, too. So we're all vulnerable to it, and the knee-jerk reaction that I see is this. Craig O'Neill: People as eventually hit that slow spell. They check, see if other people are experiencing it, too. We comfort ourselves with the fact that others are doing it, defining it as a, a market-wide symptom of broader events that we have no control over. And so then we can just comfort ourselves with another idea. Craig O'Neill: It's like, "Ah, it'll come back around." And I heard this over, and over again from my family who is owner of the business, my, my dad and my grandpa, because that has been the experience. It always comes back around. Why would we ever be okay with the fact that a slow spell also technically always comes back around? Craig O'Neill: And if our knee-jerk reaction to those moments is then to go into a, a degree of marketing or a degree of follow-up or a mass blast text strategy, like I see a lot of people fall into is like, "Huh, the work needs to be drummed up. We'll turn to our CRM system. We'll construct the perfect message and send it out, and then people will make appointments and fill our bays." Craig O'Neill: Sound familiar? Jimmy Lea: Oh, it does. It does. And if we know those, those times are gonna come back around because it's cyclical, what are we doing? We... It- Yeah ... is preventable. What are we doing that we can prevent this from happening and being that cyclical item? Because- Craig O'Neill: This is, this goes straight into it, because what I see people doing with the knee-jerk response is they're actually crippling their ability to handle the cycles of this. Craig O'Neill: When you do a knee-jerk text blast response, what's the number one reaction that you get to it every single time? Opt-outs. They are the most common reaction to this, and that's what I... If you go on the socials and you look on comment threads of shop owners experiencing a slow spell, they're asking each other "What's the perfect message that you can type out that gets fewer opt-outs and more appointments?" Craig O'Neill: There isn't one. There is no perfect message that gets X number of people. The ratio will never be the same in two demographics with unique people being the customers or clients in every one of the unique repair facilities that we have. There is no perfect message. Jimmy Lea: No. They're not. They're looking for that silver bullet, Craig. Craig O'Neill: Yes. It's silver bullet is the right term for this, and I discussed this on my podcast in an early episode of the podcast Speak Up: Effective Communication on the Automotive Repair Podcast Network. It was episode 14. I said, "What your opt-outs are really telling you," and I think that what they are telling us is something we need to listen to. Craig O'Neill: So now on that, let's move into the attention span of the people in the world today versus the past. And Jimmy, I love to read. I love deep thoughts, and we're gonna get philosophical for a second. I know you don't mind. Love it. We love this. Yeah. Let's Jimmy Lea: go. Craig O'Neill: Signature classic, C.S. Lewis. One of my favorites, Screwtape Letters. Craig O'Neill: In the early chapters in that book it's describing... I won't go into the details of Screwtape Letters, but the way that you distract someone if you're trying to distract them from serious thoughts in C.S. Lewis' time period was, and I'll quote here from the book that- Got the guy to think he was hungry, and then I showed him a newsboy shouting, "The midday paper," and the number 73 bus going past, and before he reached the bottom of the steps, I had him into an unalterable conviction that whatever odd ideas might come into the man's head when he was shut up alone with his books, a healthy dose of real life, which he meant by the bus and the newsboy, was enough to show him that all that sort of thing just couldn't be true. Craig O'Neill: He knew he had a narrow escape, and then years later was fond of talking about it. I w- I'll skip ahead. But thanks to the process which we set at work in them centuries ago, they find it all but impossible to believe in the unfamiliar while the familiar is before their eyes. So this is hard to digest 'cause it's C.S. Craig O'Neill: Lewis. You... It's like a tough piece of wonderful, awesome, the best flavor steak in the world that you gotta chew on a whole lot of times before you can actually get to digesting it. But the point is, C.S. Lewis's era, the distraction was you wanted to get them into this stream of events and that's your business is to fix his attention on the stream. Craig O'Neill: Teach it to call it real life, and don't let him ask what it means by real. And that stream is exactly what people are having today. This is a word used by C.S. Lewis before streaming like we are on a webinar, streaming across the web even existed. What distracted a man? Just being on the street with a bus and a newsboy shouting. Craig O'Neill: That's yesterday. That's 1940s United Kingdom, actually, in C.S. Lewis' time. Let's fast-forward Johann Hari's book, Stolen Focus: Why You Can't Pay Attention and How to Think Deeply Again, absolutely nails the same point in the modern age and puts a name to it with this term called the f- this frenetic digital interruption, and he says, "Is pulling our attention away from our thoughts and suppressing your default mode network," cool term. Craig O'Neill: I think we're almost in this constant stimulus-driven, stimulus-bound environment, moving from one distraction to the next, and if you don't remove yourself from that, it will suppress whatever train of thought you had, right? And I think that frenetic digital distraction really i- it's just, we have to acknowledge this is the reality we're in today, and there's people that are struggling with notifications and attention, and bombarded with media messages. Craig O'Neill: Every news article you read has the pop-up ads. Are we in that same zone like C.S. Lewis, where a newsboy and the sign on a bus is the only thing that could distract our attention? No. We are under a constant 24/7 assault for our attention span today. That's where we're communicating from, and when your shop gets a little slow and you decide you're gonna have a knee-jerk reaction to the slowness, and you expect a message to land that leads to action with a population that's drowning in this reality, would it be any surprise that it only sees marginal results? Jimmy Lea: Is there any irony that it is called streaming? Is there any irony that it's called a reel? No. Craig O'Neill: Jimmy, it's like the oldest problems are always resurfaced again in our lifetimes today- Yep ... with different technology. Jimmy Lea: Oh, it's totally different. And now it's 17-second blurbs about it's a seven-second commercial, it's a 17-second commercial. Jimmy Lea: We're being bombarded with this instant stimuli to totally distract us from what is actually real- Yes ... and consequential, and you're being bombarded by things that are momentary blurbs of Jimmy Lea: Endorphins Craig O'Neill: Yeah. It, and it just- It's a Jimmy Lea: temporary- Craig O'Neill: You're competing with that- Yeah ... tendency too, to escape with these things. You're spot on. This, this topic is why I lead into these five barriers to that are causing us, like the things that we're misusing in our CRMs, right? Yeah. I consider them barriers or hurdles because we can get over them. Craig O'Neill: Yeah ... and we can decide to lever it right. And number one and we have a slide for this, so I put it up there. I know some people like to read and some people can listen. I wanted to put this quote on there because... And I'm gonna, fatal sin of speakers, I'm gonna read the quote. I know it's on the slide, but I know some of you can't see it, and I know some of you are only listening. Craig O'Neill: Yes. I can't read it. Oh, Jimmy, I'm sorry. It's too small. Too small? Oh, that's okay. That's why I'm here. Yeah. So- You can Jimmy Lea: read all of them. Read all of Craig O'Neill: them ... it's a big meaty slide. Problem number one though is we're not communicating to people on what matters to them. That's the problem. And to reference this point the, a great read, and please write this down, pick up this book, How to Win Friends and Influence People in the Digital Age. Craig O'Neill: Amen. If you're interested in this topic at all, read that book. It's from the Dale Carnegie and Associates. So updated for the digital age. There's so many profoundly good things in this, and this is a quote I pulled straight from the book, and I wanna make sure it gets its proper reference there. Craig O'Neill: But it says, "When it comes to mattering to others, you must discuss what matters to them. Assume all else will fall on deaf, or in this case, dull ears. This is an interesting principle to consider given the spirit in which the vast majority of people are communicating today. Most messages are primarily meant to educate others about our lives, our products, to reveal compelling portions of ourselves we think others would be attracted to. Craig O'Neill: While this appears to be an assertive strategy, it is actually a passive strategy in that it requires others to connect with us." "The trouble is that's marketing monologue, not relational dialogue. It's assumption, not assimilation. When assumption guides our efforts to befriend or influence others, the results end up on the wrong side of memorable." Craig O'Neill: Okay. End quote. That is that's another, like I'm giving you solid food to digest today. That's, that's- ... we don't have time to go this layer of depth in our presentation at Mars, so that's why I'm really happy to have this conversation today. It's a primer. If you walk in primed with some of these thoughts, you're gonna be able to get a lot more out of it. Craig O'Neill: But here's where I go with this. We are communicating from a position of our interests most of the time in the auto repair shop. When it slows down, we're interested in filling our bay. If we were really interested in having those customers come in, we would have done the harder work of relating and documenting and managing the data, all sorts of things differently to have a sustained conversation that they understood the value in, because we understand what's important to them. Craig O'Neill: And that's a whole different thing, and that's gonna come up again as we move into these, these other hurdles. But I think that's the thing, first and foremost, remember what messages right now are you pushing out there that are not memorable? I didn't give this in the slide, but I have an example recently, Jimmy very recently. Craig O'Neill: I turned 43 earlier in August, and I'm not on social media these days. The one thing that was fun is getting all those birthday harvests. You know how you get all the happy birthday thing. It's actually a lot of work. Yeah. Then you gotta go like everything and all that stuff too. But don't worry, I don't miss that entirely because I have been a patron in local businesses that have CRM systems in my neighborhood chiefly my Subaru dealership where we have a, a vehicle leased presently. Craig O'Neill: And I got three happy birthday emails from three separate people in that organization. Two of them were identical emails automatically constructed, and there was a neat little quote in the bottom of one of those emails. It actually said, "This email is automatically generated, and we do not monitor replies to it." Jimmy Lea: Oh my God. That's- Craig O'Neill: But it was a beautiful picture of balloons with the branding of that dealership on it. Oh, it was touching. It was such a great birthday blessing to receive that on Sunday afternoon. Jimmy Lea: Had it been from an actual person and not an automated system would've made it even better, but... Craig O'Neill: Sure. But does the birthday greeting from a business actually land on the memorable side of communication, or is it a cheap and simple automated gimmick to feign that you care with a direct interest that is more for the business's benefit rather than it is for my birthday, right? Craig O'Neill: Congratulations, you captured my birth date in a data field in a system that is automated to generate a joy, because I don't unsubscribe because I love these examples. It really was a gift for me that I get to use and communicate from. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Yeah. And that's good. That's good. Craig O'Neill: But no, this is a common thing, and we've we've seen this strategy. Craig O'Neill: You and I have been in the CRM space for a while, and you've seen that given as a best practice. We wanna capture the, birth date and month, not the year. Birth date and month. And then you can have these sort of birthday messages go out. All right, maybe you have that strategy applied in your shop. Craig O'Neill: Is that a wrongness? No. Maybe some people really appreciate it. I think a lot of people don't give it a second thought, and that's the majority. Jimmy Lea: They probably don't, but they also aren't sending it from an email that is not being monitored and not gonna reply. Craig O'Neill: Let's hope not. Yeah. ' Jimmy Lea: Cause if Jimmy's Super Shop were to send you a happy birthday message, it would purely be a happy birthday message. Jimmy Lea: There's no other ulterior motives whatsoever. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: Jimmy- And you would reply and say, "Oh, thank you so much, Jimmy's Super Shop." We would reply again to say Craig O'Neill: I would hope so. Yeah. Now, my experience in birthdays are one thing, but all sorts of messages. I know when CRM automation occurs, and I'll touch on this at Mars a little bit further the team is not engaged in that part of the process, and it's difficult for them to engage in the inbound Present Jimmy Lea: conversation. Jimmy Lea: Yeah Craig O'Neill: Yep. There's a, a loss of continuity there. So I do feel a lot of times there's automated things going out from a shop, but there is actually no behavior that is being encouraged or directed or accountable any accountability layer for the team to be a participant in that. So it does play in that. Craig O'Neill: But this goes to number two which I think is at the root of the whole problem, and this is, again, another quote from the Dale Carnegie and Associates. First off, problem number two we're not cultivating a community, and this, this principle comes for me from my study in this book. And as I was reading that book, assessing how shops are leveraging CRMs, this stuck out. Craig O'Neill: And it says, and I quote, "Often forgotten is the long-term plan. Businesses call it a customer retention strategy, but it is best thought of as a lively, meaningful dialogue among a community of friends. If the foundation of all long-term success is the establishment of trust-based relationships, then the goal of all interactions should be to convey value as soon and as often as possible." Jimmy Lea: Not just birthdays. Craig O'Neill: Not just birthdays as a data field. What's meaningful for a client in a repair shop? What's meaningful to them in a repair shop? What is the purpose in our community, and how are you articulating the value of staying in touch so we can continue to express what this purpose is and how it benefits you? Craig O'Neill: And by the way, Mr. Client, it's very important, save this number in your phone so that you recognize that we're a contact 'cause you can reach out to us here, and we're gonna be here if you have any questions. And that's starting to get to the sense of community here. And Jimmy, this is getting more important. Craig O'Neill: In today's world, here's a tip for y'all right now. I want you to open up your phone, go to your text message app, look at the spam folder How many messages do you have in the spam folder of your messages app, whether you're using Android or Apple, does not matter. Automatically, messages are going straight to those folders with default settings from the phone's operating system and device. Craig O'Neill: There's a bunch in there, and a lot of it probably is spam, correct, Jimmy? Jimmy Lea: Oh, I'm pretty sure all of it's spam. Craig O'Neill: A lot of times it's very accurate in mine. I- I've only on occasion seen one or two messages in there. Here's how your shop is gonna land in the spam folder. If the client never accepts you as a contact and never engages in the dialogue with you in text. Jimmy Lea: Yep. Craig O'Neill: And so the manifestation of this, and I've started to see more of this recently, very recently, just this summer people sending a DVI link to their client, for example, but the client claims they never got it. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Craig O'Neill: But they do receive- Because it went to spam ... messages without the link went to the spam folder because sometimes those links are just being interpreted when it's not saved as a contact. Craig O'Neill: The solution is to get it saved as a contact. Interesting little issue, but that takes a little effort, doesn't it, to keep your client- Yeah ... to add you as a contact. There's some cool tools to do that, simple QR code scans, and lots of things we can do at the counter to help people through this problem. Craig O'Neill: But we need our advisors to express the importance of the communication and why they should want it before they'll ever accept it as a contact. Jimmy Lea: That's right. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. So interesting, right? So I think that cultivation of a community, that's the easy entry point. Help them understand the value of the communication that's coming and why we're going to be reaching you and make sure they actually do want it. Craig O'Neill: And that leads perfectly into hurdle number three. Hurdle number three is we are not gaining an opt-in for the purpose we seek. And Jimmy, you know this is true across the board generally for opt-ins and shop capturing, and we're gonna talk just a minute about this here as well. We'll do this after the next point. Craig O'Neill: The next point is a strong one on this. But you want the customer to want the message from you. Yeah. Does that happen automatically that they understand what you're going to be sending them and why you're going to be sending it? Jimmy Lea: Not unless you explain it. Craig O'Neill: Not unless you explain it. What's the value in it for them? Craig O'Neill: Why is there a benefit for them to be on a list in your shop for a certain type of message? I used an example earlier about text blast when it gets slow. And the mistake I see the most, Jimmy, is that shops literally have their all or repeat customer list, and they just hit this whole list with this message like, "Hey, we're slow. Craig O'Neill: Come in." Yeah. What if... just go with me here. Love it. What if you created a list that people could sign up and subscribe to in your shop? It's like, "Hey, if you wanna join our slow day list, there's a couple advantages of this. If you wanna just you have a few lingering maintenance items type of a thing, and we have openings we have a... Craig O'Neill: Maybe there's a promotion rate, or maybe it's just literally we can get you in and out because we know time is important, and we're not a discount culture anymore here, right? So maybe we express the speed of service. We know it's inconvenient to have the car down when it's quiet like this. We'll have loaners or rides available. Craig O'Neill: Whatever. There's benefits for you signing up on this list, so you can gain access to this thing that we're gonna do to make it better for you. Would you like to be on that list? We maybe send one or two of these out-" a quarter and perfect, right? And they sign up for that, so now you've got a warm lead list of people who are ready to fill your bays when they need filling. Craig O'Neill: How hard would it be to create that? Jimmy Lea: Oh, not very hard, and I wanna rename it already. I wanna call it the VIP available spots list. Perfect. Craig O'Neill: Yes. Yes. All sorts of things that you could do. Yeah, you could call it your membership list. Whatever. You go crazy. Have fun with it. Communicate the value of it. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. And you have some- My wife does this at art shows. She sells her art in these art shows, and she's found that even just the placement of the sign-up form matters. Like, when it's front and center, people who are waiting in line for the checkout now are able to sign into that book while they're waiting for their turn to check out with the art, and she gets way more signups for her email list. Craig O'Neill: Love it. It's perfect. Yeah, and similar practices are totally possible still today, but what do shops do? We automatically assume everyone wants to get any type of message we wanna have for any purpose, and we never clarify or distinguish any special type of thing, and thus they never get the opt-in. Craig O'Neill: And thus, what are your opt-outs telling you? Man, that's their first chance to talk to you about their preference for the type of communication you send. And you know what happens in an opt-out, Jimmy. You know as well as I do. That number's blacklisted at the carrier level. Jimmy Lea: Yep. Craig O'Neill: That's hard to undo. Now you gotta communicate to them about the value of reengaging in that by texting the word start to this number, and that's a harder thing for a busy service advisor or customer service rep to be able to engage in. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. No, it's true. It's true. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: We've gotta communicate with them on the level they want in the form that they want. And sometimes those opt-outs are them saying, "Look, I just don't want to communicate in this method." Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: But what do they prefer? Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: Might Craig O'Neill: be. Yeah. Jimmy Lea: What's the conversation? Where have you built the relationship to continue that conversation on their preferred platform? Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Look, I cooked my cellphone a long time ago doing demos of AutoFlow at, with multiple instances. Now I get texts that I forget to clear out of their thing all the time. That texting's not the best way to get me during the day. I am, however, in my inbox. And I promise you, you have clients that's the same thing for them too. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Or they don't even want... Now, go with me here. What if we had a list of people who prefer a phone call follow-up, Jimmy? Jimmy Lea: Oh, I love it. And there are. Craig O'Neill: Yes. Jimmy Lea: There's people that's what they would prefer. Craig O'Neill: Yes. 100% yes. And if you don't get the buy-in from that group, and you think everyone wants a phone call follow-up we already do this- You're wrong Craig O'Neill: at Chris' shop, Jimmy. Yeah. You wanna know in about 90 to 120 follow-up calls that we do in a week there we have a gal doing this for us, for Golden Rule Auto Care. Yeah. We get about 10 to 15% of those calls that go out end up with good connections. Like a good conversation. Jimmy Lea: Oh, they actually answer the phone and have a Craig O'Neill: conversation. Craig O'Neill: Actually answer the phone and have a conversation. Only 10 to 15% 10 to 15. Around 120 calls. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. I, Craig O'Neill: I- Not a huge number. Jimmy Lea: No, it's not. Because people are busy, and they don't wanna be interrupted. And those that want the conversations, they're the ones that answer the phone. And the other 80, 85%, 90% prefer a text message or an email or a Facebook message or purely nothing at all. Jimmy Lea: Thank you very much. Goodbye. Craig O'Neill: Let me ask you this, Jimmy. You got it, man. And when you get a phone call today from a number that's not a contact in your phone- ... do you answer it? Jimmy Lea: Voicemail. No. I- Craig O'Neill: Or screening? Yeah ... Jimmy Lea: I found the you push the two buttons on both sides, boop, right into voicemail. Done. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. I, I have, one of the call screener things on mine now. If it's not a contact, it hits that pretty much automatically. I don't answer my phone. I don't answer my phone. I then check to see the missed call, and if it is something important, I'll call it back. That's the world we're entering, and it's the same principle that we just discussed with that text message that i- if they darn a contact, same is true for the phone number that you're dialing from. Craig O'Neill: If that hasn't yet been saved as a contact, look, guys, your call isn't gonna be trusted yet. Area codes that are mine are the least trusted. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Yes. But that's the world now, and we have to be able to recognize that and combat that. Yeah ... but that involves becoming that contact, agreeing to that type of conversation, and maybe making a note somewhere in your management or CRM system about those preferred lev- levels of contact. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. So- that's the hard work here, and I understand why shops that are low staff or only have one service advisor to five technicians, and he's also the CSR, and he handles payroll because he's also the owner, and yeah, it gets really tough really fast. And you have opportunity there when you're overwhelmed to hire someone else who can do these things, that's gonna add value to your business. Craig O'Neill: They'll be able to help cultivate these lists, which ke- it's more retention, guarantees you have the income and the cashflow to be able to support their livelihood, and everything gets better. But the starting point's really tough. Problem Jimmy Lea: Number four Craig O'Neill: Let's go. All right, this one's key. Mass blasts- Oh Craig O'Neill: without express written permission are against the law. True. And this is- True ... the really bonkers part of this is shops are loosely aware of this and yet they do it anyway. I forget what the fine is right now, and I'm not a lawyer. I'm not giving legal advice. Just disclaimer on that if you can put it in bold. Craig O'Neill: Yeah, no. But I think it's a $1,500 fine per offense, and if somebody knows that they did not expressly give you permission to text them very specifically- Jimmy Lea: Yep ... Craig O'Neill: text is what we're talking about here. Yep ... that's something they could sue you for and win every time. Notice a lot of the largest organizations out there with multiple locations do not engage in this method of follow-up Jimmy Lea: Because- They Craig O'Neill: know the targets Jimmy Lea: they've lost multiple court cases. Jiffy Lube is one that comes to mind. You can Google it. Court cases where Jiffy Lube had to pay out multimillion dollars because of their mass texting clients. A- and- and what's makes it worse is that they were mass texting clients who had opted out. Craig O'Neill: Oh. Oh, no. Craig O'Neill: So they had a blacklist failure- Yeah ... which is even another thing. So yeah, this is where, okay, you videcoders out there, I know you're out there, and I know you're even playing with APIs from groups like Twilio. And you might think "Cool, we can do texting real easy." Guess what? Start managing your blacklist because Twilio sometimes doesn't do it properly for you. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. And the carrier sometimes doesn't do it properly, and it is still you on the hook every time. And if you're giving your software platform to other people to use, your platform, unless it has clear terms and conditions, could also fall under some scrutiny. Oh, boy. It gets sticky. Investigate that. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. It does. It really is. So there's a difference between mass sending a marketing message versus pinpointing and being very specific. Craig O'Neill: Oh, I'm glad you bring this up, Jimmy. Yeah we have a slide on this. So CRM permissions are not actually the same across the board in multiple channels. So the- you probably use terms like transactional versus promotional, Jimmy, I'm sure. Craig O'Neill: But industry terms do vary from- from some- And our industry itself is not usually good at taking universal language- ... Craig O'Neill: And carrying it forward. But these three categories of- of text messages, I put this out. This is I don't have the source on here, but I pulled this source from online. Craig O'Neill: Conversational, informational, promotional. I wanna draw your attention to that blue arrow on the screen. It's kind of a bluish-green arrow, Jimmy. It's on that- Yep ... one, two, three, third row down, where it's talking about how that- that message is constructed. Messages promoting a brand, a product, or a service Or anything that prompts a consumer to buy something, go somewhere, or otherwise take an action. Craig O'Neill: That, if it's in that category, requires express written consent to be legal. Express written consent. Consumers may sign a form, check a box online, or otherwise provide consent to receive promotional text message in some fashion. That express written consent is the highest form of consent, and I haven't met an organization that's tracking it yet. Jimmy Lea: And through the TCPA- Yeah ... which is the act that governs over texting and how you can communicate, it used to be that you had to have a wet signature for that promotional message to go out, and you had to retain it for seven years even after you stopped your business. You still had to have it on file. Jimmy Lea: It's now changed. You can track it digitally. Yes. But you have to be able to provide the source, the date, the time, where it consent was given- Craig O'Neill: Yeah ... Jimmy Lea: for you to send promotional messages. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Yeah ... Jimmy Lea: conversational, reminders, informational. Now and it's interesting you've got informational broke out here that you do need consent Craig O'Neill: Express consent, which is different than express written consent, and this was interesting to me when I started studying this too, and these things are pretty stable. Craig O'Neill: I don't see this element changing a lot. Yeah. But permission can happen over text on that, or on a form or a website, or verbally, and that's an interesting one. And that's just a message that contains information, just information. It's a status update, it's an appointment confirmation or a reminder. Craig O'Neill: Those types of things are information text, and that's handled- Yeah ... very differently than a promotional marketing text that's asking them to take an action. It tips towards promotional anytime you're asking them to click a link to schedule an appointment, for example, on your slow day blast type of scenario. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. That is a promotional text purely. Even if it's a deferred service reminder. Think about those deferred service drips that people have active in just about every CRM system in the world. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Craig O'Neill: That is asking the consumer to take an action, and this is exactly the type of thing I will be combating in, in, in our session at Mars 'cause we have a better way forward. Craig O'Neill: We can start talking a little bit about that here too. But those deferred work little drips are... Like, it's a strange thing to do. It's the thing your customer said no to during your visit that we're now assuming they want to receive an, a reminder about without any knowledge that this is coming, and certainly no express written consent. Craig O'Neill: And all of the burden is fully on them to take the action to make something happen about that still deferred work. Yeah. We aren't doing anything. We, in fact, automated the whole thing. Jimmy Lea: Yeah. So what's- Craig O'Neill: It's a passive reminder, as we discussed earlier, right? Jimmy Lea: What's the better way? Are we gonna discuss that here, or are you waiting for Mars? Craig O'Neill: Oh, we can ta- we can talk on it here. So our better way is, it depends on our sense of purpose here, but I think let's go to barrier number five before we talk about that better way, 'cause I think this plays into the whole topic that we're discussing. And this is really the largest barrier, and it is the, the one that I think needs to be overcome before you fix any of the other ones. Craig O'Neill: We don't have our whole organization truly oriented towards retention as a goal What are we oriented towards then? Is the question I like to ask. And if you really stop and you really think about what your organization is structured to achieve, what is it? And it might be what you consider your most important metric might give you a clue. Craig O'Neill: I think it's an interesting question to ask, Jimmy. I do this a lot in different courses. I ask what's the most important metric for a service advisor or for a technician or for this or that?" I like to ask specifically for our front counter staff, whether it be a CSR, a reservationist, a service advisor, whoever we have working our front counter. Craig O'Neill: What is their most important metric? And you get all kinds of answers. You've probably heard every one of them, Jimmy. Closing rate. Those service advisors are like, "I sell 98.92% of all work I ever write up." Terrible stat, by the way, 'cause that's the work you write up. You can artificially inflate your closing rate on sales by writing up what you know will sell. Jimmy Lea: Yep. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. But I th- I'm gonna give you my answer. Jimmy Lea: Okay. Craig O'Neill: Your ratio of returning customers Jimmy Lea: Agreed Craig O'Neill: It's your most important statistic Jimmy Lea: If they're not coming back, you're doing something wrong Craig O'Neill: Correct. Yeah, I don't care what your ARO is really. It's an interesting stat to know. You'll establish baselines for all sorts of KPIs. Craig O'Neill: They tell you useful information. But is our goal to sell all of the stuff we find on every visit? And is our team like, "Is that's what's gonna impress the boss? That's what's gonna make him very happy"? Jimmy Lea: No, returning customers. Totally agree. Craig O'Neill: Yeah, because what's the value of one good visit, right? Yeah. Craig O'Neill: What's the value of one visit versus the lifetime value of a client? Jimmy Lea: Yes. The lifetime value has so much more weight to it. Neck and neck. Tens of thousands of dollars versus- Craig O'Neill: Hundreds. Yeah ... Jimmy Lea: hundreds that, for that one visit. Craig O'Neill: Some, yeah. Yeah. And o- I had family accounts, family accounts- Yeah ... literally in the hundreds of thousands with, For Jimmy Lea: the lifetime value? Craig O'Neill: Lifetime value of that particular individual. He had a lot of vehicles in the family. Jimmy Lea: And, What's the family fleet? Craig O'Neill: It's the family fleet ... it's a family fleet. It's Jimmy Lea: a Craig O'Neill: fleet Jimmy Lea: account. Craig O'Neill: Yep. Yep, but even when the kids grew up, they were still coming in as well, too, and that, the lifetime value of the relationships that turn into more things, like, man, if that's true, though, and we do this. Craig O'Neill: Jimmy, we pay lip service to this all the time in our industry. It's a relationship-based business. It is. And then we go and we emphasize we gotta sell this much, and this is our target for sales, and all this other thing, and it's and how much time really are we putting our human attention on our team's human attention in this frenetic age on retention strategy? Craig O'Neill: Yeah. How involved are they in your team right now towards the goal of getting people back in the door from the beginning of that visit to the end of that visit, and what happens in between, the humans involved? And Jimmy, you've been in this industry. It... Most shops, I hear they say, "Hey, my guys aren't gonna use this. Craig O'Neill: I just need this to be automated." Jimmy Lea: Yeah. We'll try and make it sound as personal as possible in that automation, but Craig O'Neill: Yeah, we use those cool little variables. Your service advisor gets filled in with the service advisor's name, all the automated message, and automation has merit. It does. We create, through automation, consistent repeatability of things that we want to have occur That's good, right? Craig O'Neill: It is. Jimmy Lea: Make it personable, and make sure you're responding. Craig O'Neill: And make sure you had a hand in that, and make sure you are responding. Correct. The service advisors know these are going out, they know when it's going out, and they're maybe involved in scanning to see who replied and who didn't, or maybe that's somebody's job in the shop. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. And we'll talk about this at Mars a little further. I believe it is somebody's job in the shop. We call... I call it the reservationist. A lot of people have a CSR. Yes ... it's a fun topic because... And it goes deep, and we have podcasts on that too. But dude, it's an orientation thing. It's if it's important to you, you're gonna do something about it. Craig O'Neill: If it's not important to you, you won't do anything about it, and that's the measure that, yeah, like, all right. So I just kinda threw a C.S. Lewis mindset at you. There's like this is one of the things I love about reading some of these, these thinkers, right? It's and of course, he's Christian apologetics and that sort of thing, but he said... Craig O'Neill: i'm breaking it down to just a simple point, like something is important or it's not important at all. Craig O'Neill: That middle ground in this topic, I think this is true, that middle ground's not given to us, which forces us to either have to decide, "Eh, it's really not important and we can continue as we are because we're okay with the results," or, "No, this is a really important topic. Craig O'Neill: Our strategy for getting clients into the shop is of actually critical importance to the ultimate success of our business, and is the most important thing that we should be focusing on to guarantee our success. So we're gonna really put in all of our effort towards this goal instead of just reacting to the chaos, reacting to the things that made it in today." Jimmy Lea: Yeah. Craig O'Neill: Wow. What would happen to your business with that focus? Jimmy Lea: Oh, I love it. I love it. Yeah. Man. We wanna exponentially increase it. We wanna rocket fuel this. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: And I wonder what the statistics are. There, there was a, a, a read a while ago that talked about restaurant industry was tracking this. How can they get a client to come back for the second dining experience- Yeah Jimmy Lea: and the third dining experience, and the fourth dining experience? And once they get 'em in for that fourth dining experience, they've got a client for life. Craig O'Neill: True. Yeah. I actually just had a interesting restaurant follow-up. I'm on the email list for one of the sushi joints here in Grand Rapids. I love sushi. Craig O'Neill: Love this place. We go Maru Sushi on Cherry Street. Fantastic. Next time you're in Grand Rapids, wonderful. Love going there with my wife. It's our go-to spot. We had a couple months of a dry spell there where we didn't make it in, and we were busy with art shows and all sorts of stuff. Sure. And I got an email that must have been triggered. Craig O'Neill: It's like their little lost customer reminder. It's like- Jimmy Lea: Yeah ... " Craig O'Neill: It's been a while. Here's a free app- appetizer" Okay ... for next, on, on your next visit." It was an interesting follow-up. I thought it was really good. Oh yeah, it has been a while. Man, I want sushi right now, is what I experienced with that. Craig O'Neill: And then, and there's a benefit for me right there in it, and I already wanna go there anyways. It's just been a while. Jimmy Lea: Yes. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: It's a great way of getting you back in. I, there, there was the example That the manager would go around and say, "Oh, is this your first time?" They had different colored napkins, so he knew- The servers ask us, they're the new ones that don't recognize us. Jimmy Lea: They ask, "Have you guys been in before?" It's like, "Oh, yeah." Yeah. All right. "You can hold on to the menu. N- unless you need it to show us that you haven't taken the order yet," right? Yeah. Yeah. The the managers are going around and they're giving away, "Hey, on your second visit, make sure you try the cheesecake, and here's a coupon for a free cheesecake." Jimmy Lea: You get me back for a $100 meal for a free cheesecake, is it worth it? Craig O'Neill: Totally. Jimmy Lea: What's that cheesecake cost you? Craig O'Neill: Cheapest marketing. All right. So look- Cheesecake more cost ... how much Jimmy Lea: money Craig O'Neill: do you spend on other marketing efforts for what kind of results? Jimmy Lea: Yeah. And we've got to do the optimizing everywhere. Jimmy Lea: We've got to optimize ourself in all the locations. There's, which is true. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: But also how effective, and it's extremely, ex- extremely effective when they're there at your shop enjoying the experience, you give them a reason to come back. Craig O'Neill: Yes. And I like what you said there, Jimmy, and I think that's worth drawing some out a little further. Craig O'Neill: What you described is what I we have an improv club in our Toastmasters club, so the we play a lot of improv games, and we've been taught the yes and- Yes and ... approach. Yes and. Yes and. It is, it's, so it's a rule in improv where one of the people in your troupe are make something, that's truth now. Craig O'Neill: You react with that. It's not, you can't go combat this thing. It's not this or this. It's these things now have to be recognized as, as connected. The reality of Jimmy Lea: what you create. Combining forces for something good. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. So you said- Using that idea ... all networks, all channels, and this is exactly it. Craig O'Neill: This conversation that we're having doesn't say "Oh, yeah, we just master this and we won't need to spend as much money in this other area." That's not necessarily the case. Now, although maybe you have have some restructuring of that, it's you do refine your strategy on how your team is engaging retention, and you continue your outreach efforts, and maybe restructure how your phone call skills and other things go into all the m- effort you did take towards generating leads actually gets converted into real clients that come back again. Jimmy Lea: Oh, yeah. W- I was talking to a shop the other day, "My marketing's not working. My marketing's not working. I need to redo all my marketing." Got digging into his phone call log, discovered 43% of phone calls were- Ooh ... not being answered. No. 43%. Craig O'Neill: This is the world th- that AI assistants are entering. Craig O'Neill: And Jimmy- Yes ... this is this is the deepest, saddest thing in the world for me. AI assistants are one, a thing that is i- in demand and two, that it's sometimes better than the Jimmy Lea: people. If you're not able to answer the phone, you need to figure out either you need a human that's there answering the phone, or you implement this AI answering system- Oh, man Jimmy Lea: that's tied to your point of sale that sees your schedule, that can schedule- Better Craig O'Neill: at containing the context and keeping the notes and everything else ... four different... Jimmy Lea: Absolutely. Craig O'Neill: Yeah, I know. Jimmy Lea: And it's true. If- I do not support the idea that the AI answering your system is going to replace your advisor. Jimmy Lea: Absolutely not. Yeah. Craig O'Neill: No. Jimmy Lea: You do need to answer the phone as quickly as you humanly possibly can, but if you're not able to, that's where you've got this backup that can take care of business. And it's an interesting thing. Craig O'Neill: And this backup Jimmy Lea: is just that. Yeah. It needs to be backup, not plan A. Craig O'Neill: Oh, not plan A. Craig O'Neill: And in fact, you need to be aware And we were having this conversation in our team, too 'cause our sales guys, when they're calling shops, they're hitting AI- Jimmy Lea: Yes ... Craig O'Neill: systems far more frequently than they ever used to, and it's interesting to see that volume go. But simultaneously, we understand, like, how do you feel personally when you call a business and the first thing you get is an AI? Craig O'Neill: Are you happy or a little sad about that? And in an election year right now, it has turned divisive. And we did tailor- trace this back to this really started about two weeks ago. Even in demos where we're talking about AI features- ... the data center issue is coming up. And, like, all these things are, like, top of mind, front and center. Craig O'Neill: "Oh, I can't believe you guys are engaging with AI stuff in this world right now." And it's oh, wow, hot button issue. You have an AI assistant, you probably are gonna have a 50/50 split. I'm y- I'm talking 50/50. Some people will love it and think it's fine or just tolerate it. The other 50% are going to hate it, hate you, and may never call you again. Craig O'Neill: And congratulations, now we're in 2026. Yep. Jimmy Lea: And I, I think the 50/50 might be a little, Craig O'Neill: I'm just thinking about how the elections play out- Jimmy Lea: Yeah ... for two different parties. I propose there's probably a 30%, maybe a 33% that loves it, 33%- Fair ... that hates it, and 33% that's in that middle that says, "Ah." Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: I Craig O'Neill: would love to see a strong third party too, Jimmy, but that's neither here nor there. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. So look at this though. We talked orientation. We don't have a whole organization structured towards retention. Now I had a great coach. Bob Greenwood was my coach. He passed away 2021. And I talk about this frequently. I echo what he taught me a long time ago, and he described our professional responsibility. Craig O'Neill: He asked the question, "What's our job? What's our job? What is your job?" I remember being the technician in the room that raised my hand, and I told him what he was expecting someone in the room to raise their hand and say. Jimmy Lea: Fix cars. " Craig O'Neill: I fix cars." Yep. He pounced. He was ready. This is what he did. I've seen him do it multiple conversations after that. Craig O'Neill: He said, "No. Your job, your professional responsibility, is to make sure the vehicle's safe, reliable, and efficient. That's the job. And that, Mr. Client, is why we do a multi-point inspection on every vehicle that we do, and we will send this digitally to you, and we won't let you down." And there's lots more that goes into that, but there's a whole underlaying sense of purpose about the service that we provided. Craig O'Neill: And if that is our job, to make sure the vehicle's safe, reliable, and efficient, we owe it to our customers to be participants in that- Yeah ... as a member of the community of which they are also driving in. It has direct benefits to us and the other people we love on the streets. But that's an orientation, right? Craig O'Neill: And if that is what you believe about your purpose in this industry- Amen ... yeah, we're gonna start following up with the strong ability to communicate that sense of purpose, and people will hear the conviction in there and that commitment that you made to not letting them down. And that is not going to be heard in your competitors. Craig O'Neill: If you master this, and you don't, you will stand out, I promise you. Jimmy Lea: It's true. It's true. Yeah. Craig, this is a, a phenomenal conversation that we're having, talking about all things marketing, customers, customer relationships. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Jimmy Lea: Managing those relationships, communicating in their preferred method, form, and fashion. Jimmy Lea: This is gonna continue in our Mars Conference. I can't wait. Let's throw up that QR code again. If you are able to attend, and you are listening to this, today is... What day is today? Craig O'Neill: Today is the 9th. Jimmy Lea: September 9th It's called Wednesday. September 9th, intensive giveaway winners. Oh, don't forget the giveaway winners here, Craig. Jimmy Lea: We've- Oh ... le- but- Great Do you wanna announce the winners first, or do you wanna announce the the special giveaway for everybody listening? Craig O'Neill: Let's do the winners first, Jimmy. I'm excited. So we had a drawing as we had two tickets to give away to Mars, and we have two winners, and we'll be sending emails to these winners as well. Craig O'Neill: Winner number one, Preston Callahan. Winner number two, Jordan Jawarenko. And we will get those emails out to you and hope to see you in Utah. And yeah bring your hiking shoes if you wanna go up in the hills with me. I definitely encourage getting up in the hills. So- Jimmy Lea: Are you gonna be rucking? Craig O'Neill: Oh, see, when I'm in the hills I don't just bring useless weight, I bring actual hiking gear, so I just call it hiking when I'm actually in a mountain. Jimmy Lea: When you're in Utah, you go hiking. Yeah. Everywhere else it's Craig O'Neill: rucking. Yeah. Rucking is what I would call urban hiking. Jimmy Lea: It's for you flatlanders. Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Yeah. So no, I will definitely be ha- I have a pack, I have I put water in there for weight and snacks that I can eat, and the, the idea is you get it lighter as you go with that sort of stuff, but- Oh ... it's absolutely beautiful. So these- Yeah ... are the winners from the Autoflow drawing that we'd had. Craig O'Neill: Those of you who did not win on that drawing, we'll still email you and hope to see you in Utah. Take advantage of this promotion. I think it's gonna be a great conversation. I've done this intensive multiple times. Jimmy, I gotta give you guys some props on this because this is my favorite format literally in all events that I go to. Craig O'Neill: You're in one room together at your headquarters in Ogden, Utah- Yeah ... which is a cool town. Everyone hears the same presenter. We get everyone here asking those same questions, and then- Yep ... the next presenter's gonna be up, and then we do that. We have great food in between, and then there's breakout sessions afterward where we get to go and break out into groups and discuss everything that's done. Craig O'Neill: No one's missing any of the context from any of the presentations. It's not like you're in one session and then another session is going on and "Man, that would've been a cool talk too, but this is really good." You don't have any fear of missing out on anything that's happening. Everybody's a participant the whole way. Craig O'Neill: It's awesome. Jimmy Lea: Oh, and I love the, the vendors are included. Everyone is in the same- Yeah ... room, and we're having these conversations together. It's not just shop owner to shop owner point of view. We get everybody's point of view in on these conversations- Yeah ... which is super awesome. All right. So if you scan this QR code, grab out your smartphone, scan this QR code, this is a coupon. Jimmy Lea: It is on- coupon, oh, I hate calling it that. Yeah. This is a special member VIP. Because you are watching this webinar, this is a cu- the, this code is good until 12:00 AM tomorrow morning, Pacific Daylight Time The code is, and I have to switch over to my other computer, the code is Mars300. This is $300 off of the general admission pricing. Jimmy Lea: So you and a- anybody of the public that is out there, you will get the webinar, the the whole entire intensive, Mars Intensive at the institute member pricing. So use the code Mars, M-A-R-S 300, and that is good until, for in the next, what? 12 hours? Craig O'Neill: Yeah. Where are we? 10, 12- And after Jimmy Lea: you fill that out- Oh, 13 hours. Jimmy Lea: You got 13 hours. Ready, set, go. Go ahead ... after Craig O'Neill: you fill that out, email us and I will tell you my favorite two sushi joints in Ogden, Utah, and maybe we can even grab a bite there. Jimmy Lea: Ooh, that's great. And you know what? We do have a couple of more tickets available. There's not a lot, but there are a few more tickets available for that exclusive dinner with Cecil Bullard. Craig O'Neill: Nice. Jimmy Lea: We're gonna have some great conversations. Those that are speakers are invited to be able to be part of this conversation and it's an exclusive dinner with Cecil, so you're gonna have some really good, intense, great conversations with the speakers of the event, with Cecil being there. These are gonna be some really good focused conversations. Jimmy Lea: Those Craig O'Neill: are my favorite moments, Jimmy. Yeah, the event is one thing, but the conversations that happen throughout and at dinners these... If you're not frequently going to industry events like this is... You owe it to yourself to do this. The ideas that you get to go back with are phenomenal, and the connections that you make and the sense of community that you feel that, that's permanent Jimmy Lea: Agreed. Jimmy Lea: Agreed. Couldn't have said it better. Thank you, Craig. Oh, yeah. Congratulations to Preston. Congratulations to Jordan. Look forward to seeing you in Ogden, Utah, October 26th, 27th and 28th, right before SEMA Apex. And for those who are the adventurous types rent a car. Let's go drive down through Zion and Bryce Canyon and- Yes Jimmy Lea: I'm sure Craig Craig O'Neill: and- Zion. If you haven't been to Zion National Park, what is that place? It is beautiful. It is. Southern Utah, phenomenal, dude. I could go... We have another hour here, so we can just talk about Southern Utah. Man, dude- ... you guys have got the pocket of beauty in this world. It is phenomenal. Craig O'Neill: Like- Jimmy Lea: It's gorgeous. Yeah. It is gorgeous. Craig O'Neill: Absolutely. You will... And Salt Lake City's no joke either. You fly in there, you're gonna think, "This is amazing," and it is. And then you go to Southern Utah and you think "What is... It gets better?" Jimmy Lea: Yep. Yep. Glad you had a great experience with your family down there in Southern Utah. Craig O'Neill: Dude, my wife and I are flying out a little early. We're staying through the weekend before the Mars Intensive we're gonna be hiking some hills then too. It's hard to get the bigger hikes in between the event stuff. Jimmy Lea: Yes. Craig O'Neill: It gets dark- Yes, it is ... it gets hard on the mountain. Jimmy Lea: It does. It does. Jimmy Lea: Even with that, it's not quite enough. I got you. With that, thank you, Craig. I appreciate you being here, brother. Oh, thanks. Thank you so much. Look forward to Mars- Can't wait ... the Mars Intensive. Let's continue this conversation. Let's get in deeper with these conversations and have a great time. I will see you there. Jimmy Lea: Thank you, everybody. See Craig O'Neill: you soon.

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