Episode 280 - Forgiveness, Mentorship, and Saving Lives in Shops With Tyler Steever

0:00For years, the automotive industry has been plagued with the perception of shady business practices, greedy owners, and incompetent technicians. It's time we flip the script. Good clap, David. I'm very proud of you. I don't know if you know this, but this is not a standard podcast, David. We started this podcast in order to bring everyone together to have the tough conversations everyone's been avoiding.

0:31Instead of endless complaining and pointing out the problems, we seek to get everything out in the open and look for real solutions. To do that, we bring on industry experts, vendors that are changing the game, multi-million dollar shop owners, as well as those that are struggling every single day to pay the bills, and everything in between. We're not professional podcasters pretending to know how it is.

0:56We're in the trenches every single day trying to pay the bills and hopefully achieving some success. So if you're tired of overly polished scripted conversations, it's time to tune in to the Changing the Industry podcast. Lucas and I are proud to partner with the Institute for Automotive Business Excellence as a means to help shops, whether they're getting off the ground, hiring their first technician, or looking to pass along their business to a new generation.

1:29So jump down to the show notes and check the link in the description, which will take you to their events page. The Institute is committed to bringing world-class training to shops all over the country, including their Leadership Intensive, their MARS Intensive, and the Service Advisor 3-Day Intensive. Some of these events take place all over the country, so jump down to the show notes, click the link, find an event near you, and experience world-class training unlike anything else you've seen.

2:03And now on to the episode. Let's just select it. There you go. Oh, Tyler. Introduce yourself, brother. My name is, uh, Tyler Stever. I'm a 4-year tech, been in the industry about that long. Kind of started off working on some campers, and then that small town dealership, you know, had a used car dealership that sold campers and cars, so they taught me to work on cars, and then Just a couple years ago, I kind of moved into a little more independent, smaller shop, and, uh, happened to be one of the few shops in our area that shut the whole shop down and brought everybody down to Vision.

2:52Oh yeah, yeah, especially where we're from. Yeah, I mean, I can count on one hand, I think, the amount of guys that come from our area. Where are you from? Uh, Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Very cool. Yeah, very cool. I love South Dakota. I, I do too. I'm not kidding. I absolutely love South Dakota. If it wasn't for the weather, you are not kidding.

3:16I would 100% move there. I, uh, I do the rodeo thing in my free time and, uh, was chatting with a gal from Texas a couple weeks ago, and she was telling me about how, uh, she was never coming back because it was like 30 below and the wind was blowing 50 miles an hour, and it's like Yeah, you know, I can respect that.

3:37Yeah, pretty common. The summers are nice though. Yes, that's my, my perspective. I enjoy the cooler times of the year. You know, we only get a month or so that it's really hot. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. How did you become a technician? Tell us a little bit about your journey to becoming a technician. Um, Well, at the time I was working on trailers at this very— it was a hole-in-the-wall shop, for lack of a better explanation.

4:10Is that where you— that was your first job, or was that your— oh no, boy. As far as like me wanting to become a tech, the electronics side is kind of what led me to— got it. And the fear of it, in my opinion. I I've always been a do-it-myself kind of guy, you know, love to— as a kid, well, I grew up on a farm, so we fixed all our own tractors and equipment.

4:40And so it came to this point where, you know, owning a vehicle, yeah, I couldn't fix it anymore, you know. And it was like almost this challenge of— or opportunity, I should say, to fill that gap of being able to repair these vehicles as well as provide that for other people, you know? Yeah. Yeah. And so did you, when you started this journey, like, how did you end up in the trailer shop?

5:11Was it like, hey, this is where I want to start? Is that— it's on— he's on Interstate 29, dude. Yeah. On 90. 29 and 90, right? Well, no, I'm just asking, like, how— 90, like, it's super— like, it runs from this side of the country to that. All they do is see tractor trailers. Oh, I understand. I'm saying, like, how, how did you end up there?

5:35How did I end up at this trailer place? Yeah, they were family friends that I had rodeoed with my whole life, uh, and it kind of wanted them deals where I needed a job and happened to be at an event, and that's where the trailer thing started. Okay. The, the car thing, funny enough, job opening in my town that we live in, you know, 5 blocks away from home.

6:02Yeah. And it was like they wanted a camper tech or a trailer tech who would be willing to grow into an automotive tech, right? Cool. Yeah. And It was cool until I realized they were full of crap. Yes. You know, they didn't want me to be a tech, right? You know, they wanted me to do the leftovers after all the other techs were filled.

6:30It was like, here, get through these, right? Yeah. Yep. And it was like, so I ended up being that guy for both sides of the shop. Oh man. So you— it was, it was kind of like a dog. So you were getting crap jobs from both bands. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Oh yeah. And very literally crap jobs as far as campers. I mean, right.

6:50Yeah. The black water tanks, the really shitty situations. Oh yeah. You know, people leave them sit for 6 months and don't touch them. Oh yeah. Oh dude, though, I can't deal with campers. I don't know how you people deal with that and stuff. What do you do with the rodeo? What do I do with rodeo? Typically, I do an event called team penning.

7:08Okay. 3 contestants, men or women, on horses out in the arena. They— there's 30 head of cattle out there and they're numbered 0 through 9. So you have 3 of each number and you and your team ride out into the arena and you get 90 seconds to take those 3 cattle that have your number and put them in a pen. 10 by 10 pen on the other, the opposite end of the arena.

7:34But they're mixed in with all the other. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. I can show you guys videos a little later. Yeah, that'll be awesome. It's, it's an adrenaline rush. I'm sure it is. Yeah. That's pretty cool. The whole rodeo thing is an adrenaline rush. It's cool. Yeah. Yeah. And I sing the anthem. Really? Yes, sir. I got to sing the anthem for Vision last year.

7:57What? Yeah, dream come true, dude. Dude, that's pretty crazy. Yeah, that's pretty crazy. It was. Well, so now you moved— I bet you have a really high singing voice. Do you just like sit on this? Um, I can sing both bass and tenor. Oh, can you really? Yeah. That's impressive. Uh, that's something I've been doing since like 4 or 5 years old.

8:20Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Wow. How did you end up at the, the next shop? Tell us how you got there. So I come to this point at my career at this small town dealership where it was like I had been to Vision 2 years in a row. Okay. My mentor was really feeding into me. Was the dealership sending you to the Vision? Yeah.

8:42Yes. Yep. They— and that's the thing, like they were taking care of me as far as getting the knowledge. Okay. But it was one of them— They just weren't seeing the work. Right. It was one of them deals like once I had the knowledge, it was like, how ready were they for me to be that guy? Yeah. You know, and that was one thing my mentor Kent was— he sacrificed, you know, to help me grow.

9:04And it was like I bid on all the electronic stuff and I love scope work and stuff like that. And it was like that didn't correlate with the guy they were asking me to be. You know, as far as just their— the brake, you know, doing brake jobs, doing oil changes. Right. They want to part change them. Right. And that was just it.

9:25They weren't, they weren't interested in me being the tech that I was wanting to be, you know, and seeing coming from my mentor. Right. You know? Yeah. And it was, they had, they had other guys in the shop who were your typical A-techs, you know? Yeah. You know, that bad attitudes and— Yeah, kind of toxic workplace kind of thing. Yeah, and it wasn't— they were good guys, don't get me wrong, you know, but they weren't like Kent was, where it was like sharing with him, or him sharing with me, was his passion.

10:06Yeah, you know. Yeah, that's rare. Oh dude, crazy rare. Yeah, yep. It was like him seeing me grow was fulfilling for him. Yeah, yeah. I want to know about the rodeo thing. So how'd you get into the rodeo thing? Uh, family. My— I grew up on a cattle ranch farm. Uh, yeah, my family farms corn, beans, like 3,000 acres. And then you don't look it, by the way.

10:33And, uh, it was something that I just did with my dad, and then it grew into kind of my thing. And we, in our area, we actually own a a full-size indoor arena and we put on events. So that's cool. That's awesome. I'm, I'm 34 and I can legitimately say that like I've helped my family put on these type of events for 30 years and that— wow.

11:00Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know, is it right there in Sioux Falls? The arena that we own is 10 miles west of Tea, which is like a small suburb of Sioux Falls. Okay. When you're coming in on 29, T is like just on the southwest side of Sioux Falls. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So it's not far. Yeah. How often do you guys do those?

11:23We put on those team penning events about once a month. Okay. And then there's a couple of different barns in the area that we, you know, kind of correlate with and share schedules. And do people come in from all over the country to do it? And yeah, when What do I want to take my kids? My son was totally into it. He was like, he's like, I want to go to rodeo.

11:45I'm like, hell yeah, let's go see some freaking dude. Even some men do men shit, dude. I'm telling you, even just getting— it doesn't matter what state you're in, even just getting to the events. Yeah. And there, I mean, there's good people everywhere, but going to a rodeo, like, I promise you, you will meet some of the most wholesome people. 100%. And like, that's just South Dakota shit, dude.

12:07I'm just telling you. Yeah. I mean, I will say that the that kind of rodeo scene, I felt terrible because there's a stockyards in my hometown and they got a reputation. A bunch of college kids and a bunch of younger kids started going and really making a mess of things. And it was that they went out there and they wanted to drink and they wanted to get wild and there wasn't a lot of supervision.

12:30And so a young lady, she was walking down the street and one of those kids hit her and killed her. And so it really just— and because the local EMS and sheriff's department had been complaining nonstop like, Hey, we're having a lot of problems here. Don't let your kids go out here. Don't let this. And so it gave the whole event a bad name.

12:48And it wasn't anything to do with the event. It was just that, like, you're trying to grow an event and these people are coming out. It becomes really hard to police. Oh yeah. Who can come out, who can do this, who can do that. And then a kid got killed on a bull. And so he, he came off the bull and the bull stepped like on the edge of his rib cage.

13:09And it, it slammed his ribs through his heart. Oh yeah. And so it was, you know, it happened. That's like when I say it's men doing men shit, like that's what I'm talking about. Like, and I could die. Professional rider, I get it. But I'm saying like, well, I'm just saying these animals aren't like docile. These are like big aggressive animals. I'm just saying it was like, it was bad timing.

13:33It was. I'm not saying it's a freak accident. It was a freak accident after somebody else had been hit and killed, after this other thing. It was Yeah, it was just bad timing. But you're right. I do think that that is a crowd of, like, good, wholesome human beings for the most part, just like any other crowd. I mean, if we're being realistic, worse than some others.

13:53I mean, you look at the typical portrayal of a cowboy in our society, you know, I mean, they're not the, the cleanest, you know, smoothest edged people. Yeah. You know, and it's like it's Especially if you think about the cool cowboys smoking, drinking, you know, it was like the Marlboro Man. Like that was the ideal cowboy as far as in that time period.

14:18And it's like you get that group of people that strive to be that. Yeah. You know, and that goes too far sometimes. It does. But like those men that were actually the Marlboro Man. Oh, yeah. Right. The one difference was, is they were rough and they were rowdy, but they had integrity. Oh yeah. Right. They, they would die on their integrity. I knew quite a few of them.

14:38Right. And that integrity to them. Yeah. Their word and who they were and doing the right thing for other people. And they were there for people when even if somebody was a piece of shit and they got in a fight the night before. Right. They were still there for them the next day. Yeah. Right. And so I think that that crowd has more integrity, in my opinion, than a lot of the other crowds out there.

14:58Right. So I will give them that. Well, so you moved to this other shop. Tell us about the journey to the other shop. The other shop, uh, started with a phone call, kind of a like, hey, would it be worth me applying type of deal? Because at that point I was still fairly stuck in this, or I felt stuck in this dealership, and honestly like considering getting out of the industry.

15:25And, uh, the general manager at the time was like, Yeah, of course, you know, come apply. And, uh, had a short conversation with him here at Vision. It was right around this time. And, uh, interview when I got back, they were just happening to be opening a new shop. Okay. And expanding. Uh, got hired on, got started on at this new shop.

15:52The guy that they hired with me was supposed to kind of be a mentor type of guy, turned out not really to be that. Yeah. And the shop was struggling and the general manager pulled me aside and they— he said, he's like, I want you to go to our other shop to where then they had, you know, base of clientele and good people to train me.

16:22And, uh, so I got to move over to this other shop. When I get over there, and I had met these guys, but of course I say I'm 34 and they were all 28 and under, shop foremen and everything. And, uh, I was just blown away by how responsible and respectable and, yeah, mature this whole like group of guys was. And yeah, it's grown into, you know, good friendship, good morale as far as the shop.

17:02It's— yeah, it— moving to this shop inspired me honestly to keep— that's awesome— keep going. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. What, what are we doing for training right now? How— tell us a little bit about that trajectory of gaining the skill and the knowledge and, and picking up this diagnostics. Have you given— have they given you the bandwidth to learn that and develop it?

17:23Yes. Um, I mean, obviously we have weekends like this as far as Vision. They pay for, uh, in our area, both O'Reilly's and NAPA have training courses that they host, you know, a couple times a month, and they pay for that. Uh, they're real supportive of what we do, right? You know, right. Yeah. What, what are you doing to personally develop? Because I— one of the things that we struggle with in my shop is I see the guys Like we'll pay for the training, we'll take them to the training events, but then I'm not seeing it grow necessarily translate into knowledge and ability gained.

17:59You know that? Yep. Steckler put it good today in class. He said you got to waste some time. Yeah, that is one thing I have done. I feel like is we've got some younger guys at the shop, like new guys that I kind of enjoy sharing this information with as well as using it as something for me to build my comfortability with it.

18:29Okay. You know, uh, one skill that I think, or I believe that I have, is that I'm, I'm good at teaching. Okay. My wife and I do put on clinics and like teach people how to train horses and It's something that I have tried to use to my gain. You know, I, I, uh, I love to come and watch all the instructors here specifically if we're just talking about this and the way they interact with people as well as tell us to, you know, waste some time.

19:10Let's get the scope out, test known good vehicles. Brandon is particularly good. Oh yeah, yeah, yep. And I mean, there's a lot of really good ones, but besides that, I mean, that is something that I have tried to— because that's one I'm not great at wasting time, in my opinion. I love my family. I love to be at home, like, with my kids.

19:37Yeah, for For sure. But I use the, the want to help other people to, you know, force myself to do it. Yeah. Because I will say that is something I noticed, like my— especially at that dealership, I was coming to Vision and getting all this great information, but I wasn't fixing cars. I wasn't using that information. You weren't using it and going back.

20:01And until you use it, it doesn't really develop. No, it doesn't stick. No. And so if you're not getting the chance to use it, and then I'm going to be honest with you, I think for me, teaching what I can of that knowledge is the most rewarding part, right? Because like, yeah, I can go fix the car, but after a while, fixing the car to me wasn't rewarding anymore, right?

20:22Like, I'd fixed so many at that point, it's like, this is— but, but when I can teach somebody else to do it and see that multiply out beyond just what I can do myself, right? And see them take something and say, wow, like there is something addictive about seeing the light bulb go off. Yes. Right. And then pick it up and actually get it.

20:41That is the most rewarding thing I think I've ever done. Right. You know, there is little— not that it's not exciting to fix a vehicle, but there's like little love found there, you know? And like, that's one thing, I'm a feely guy. Yeah. You know, and I I enjoy relationships for sure. And that's like, even if we're talking about fixing a car for a customer, like, I find more drive in helping somebody than the actual fixing of the car.

21:15Yeah, you know? Yeah, that's me. David is definitely not that. David is just like, hey, can I get my money now? Um, he doesn't even want that. He just gives me the money. I was still waiting for that money. I'm just— I'll be honest with you. I'm waiting for the day that you break into a laugh like that that turns into a cry.

21:36Start sobbing. Yeah, I think I'm too broken to cry. How old are your kids? 8 and 5. 8. Oh, man. Good years. What's that? You're gonna have more? I don't know. Dude, you gotta have more. Yeah, I like— we stopped at 2 and like I wish, I wish I'd like— I told, I told my wife like, if we could do it again, I would have had you barefoot and pregnant in that kitchen and popping kids out for 10 years straight.

22:06And she's like, what? I'm like, yeah, we would have had freaking 10 kids just running around creating sheer chaos in the house. It's just loud as shit, house a mess, kids hanging off of me and shit. That would have been awesome. It's such a bittersweet thing, you know. You, you get these kids as babies. For lack of a better explanation, they're almost this slight burden, you know.

22:31Yeah. And then you watch them grow and become people, and that, that's the first part of it is, you know, a little frustrating. They're learning how to be this new thing. You just don't realize, right? And you're teaching them, like, it's your first time teaching too, and it's like Then you get to the point where they've kind of developed their own personality and you realize you don't get that again.

22:52Oh, buddy. You know? Yeah. I'm telling you, man. Boy, girl, boy, girl. 2 girls. Oh, buddy. You're in for it. Oh, man. You're in for it. I love— I love having girls. Like, my baby girl is the best thing ever. It's like I tell everybody, if you're going to have whatever you have as your first kid, have it be a girl. Because that, especially for a dad, like that, that turns the whole kid having experience on its head.

23:19Yeah. And like, and so all of a sudden you're like, let's have more. What, when you think about the values that you want to instill in them, what are the key values you think you want to instill in them? I I'm big on love and I'm big on sacrifice. I come from a broken divorced family and I have a lot of trauma-developed things from that point in my life that, you know, I kind of let define my view of myself for like a long time.

24:11Like, if I'm being honest, like 24 years of my life, I hated myself. Yeah. Oh man. And when I look back at it now and I think about like kind of where that all started and that belief of me you know, me being my problem, those are the things that like I'm— and when I say sacrifice, that's what I mean. Like it means more, or I want more than anything to provide my children with that household, you know, and that— That stability.

24:49Yeah. Yeah. And it's like— That sense of security. That's one thing. And I just lost my mom this last weekend. Oh, I'm sorry. We had chatted about that. Uh, that's one thing her and I had discussed towards the end was like, relationships are not perfect. Yeah, you know, and it's like one thing I'm proud that my wife and I agree on is like together with the stability we can provide is 10 times what it could be apart.

25:20Yeah, yeah, you know, I think too many This is something like me and my wife, we both came, like she came from a divorced household. Her childhood was a mess. I came from a divorced childhood. She had it worse off than I did. I didn't have it the best either. But like when we got married, we'd been together for a while, but when we got married, like we told each other like, this is a commitment for life.

25:46Like either we do this or we don't. And if we don't— if we're not going to, to the end, no matter what, come hell or high water, like, before God and family and, and everybody, like, this is till death. And, and she's like, I'm there. And, right, and that was it. And so, like, the possibility of, oh, we'll just get a divorce, like, that was off the table.

26:09And that was never— it's never in the consideration. Like, even as bad as things could possibly get, it's not a consideration, right? And so Like, if you come into it with that mindset, knowing that come hell or high water, like, this is going to work, like, we're making a commitment for our kids and we're going to build something here, you walk into it like that, the problems get dampened, right?

26:32Like, you can still— you like, we'll figure it out. Yep. It can't be that bad. It's like that, you know, there's a lot of those Jordan Peterson videos where he's talking about that. He said, like, when you, when you commit to a vow and like you have to understand what that is. Right. And like when you say that no matter what, it doesn't matter what happens, it doesn't matter what you say, I'm not going to run from this problem.

26:56Right. Like that is when maturity begins. Well, and that, that for me is like where the love part of it comes into play. Yeah. You know, like, and what is love? And like, in my opinion, it's the willingness to be understanding. Yeah, in, in any moment, for sure. You know, like true empathy kind of takes the ability to sacrifice your own feelings sometimes to— yeah, yeah— understand how, how and why somebody else feels the way they do.

27:33That's like, that, that's one thing my wife and I talk about all the time. It's like no matter the feeling you're having or why you're having it, like, yeah, that you're allowed to have that feeling, you know? Absolutely. And I, you know, I've fought really hard. Um, my dad, I love him very much, but my dad was known to be a hard-ass, right, in a lot of ways.

27:56And, um, he wanted what he wanted. And, and there's a lot of things about me, like, I catch myself getting frustrated about something that doesn't matter And it happens before I realize I'm frustrated, right? Right. And one of the struggles I had is my wife's come to me multiple times and said, hey, look, I need you to understand that we're in this together.

28:14And if I'm doing something that you think is I'm trying to do the opposite of what you want and us not have a good life, you're crazy, right? Like, we're trying to do this together, but I need you to meet me halfway, right? And so I grew up in a household where my mom just oftentimes would be like, You know what? I just don't want to fight about it.

28:33We're not going to fight about it. We'll just do it. Right. And she would go on and do whatever she wanted to do anyway. She wouldn't ever. But, but the thing was, is like, it was hard for my dad to say, we're on a journey together and we're working towards the same goal. Right. Right. And I think that that's one of the hardest things for me to say.

28:50All right, I get this. We're in this together. It may have been hard for him to say it, but it was because it was in his actions. You don't stay married that long owning a business, small business, for sure, having a devil child as his youngest. Valid point, David. Valid point. No, I mean, you're absolutely— you've heard the story about the shit he did as a kid, right?

29:15Like, like the, the scars on the head and the, the four-wheeler, and he was a wild child. Yeah, yeah. But you don't, you don't go through all that come hell or high water, and you still stayed together. Like, like, we're still gonna make this work, even towards the end. Because some of these old people, they're like, oh, kids are out of the house, let's just get divorced now so we can go live our lives, or whatever nonsense they tell themselves.

29:37Yeah, 57 years married. Like, he may not have said it, but that— his actions said it, is what I'm saying. Like, he didn't have to say it. 100%. But I mean, I guess what I'm saying is, is that, that so many of these divorces, I feel like, come from 2 people being so hard-headed about their own agenda that they don't realize that we should be working towards a common agenda.

30:00That's a good song, by the way. We should be working— Husbands and Wives, right? Yeah, Brooke Stone did it, and it's a Neil Diamond song. Yeah, but I mean, shouldn't we be working towards a common goal, right, together, going in the same direction for the same united purpose? But what I'm saying is your parents assumed it. It was— they walked into that marriage with that assumption.

30:20Like, today it's not common. Of course, today it's like, we're doing this because we love. And but that goes away. Like, the attraction and the— yeah, I wouldn't say the attraction, but the fuzzy feelings, the butterflies, the butterflies go away. And, and now it's like, you know, you get used to this person or whatever. And so like, the, the effort to maintain that relationship, it's work.

30:43Like, you got to keep the relationship up. But if you walk into it with the assumption that like, this is forever. Yeah, this is forever. We're a team. We're going to make this happen and solve so many issues. So yeah, I mean, kudos to you. Like, that's amazing too. That's what I'm saying. You got to have more kids. I appreciate that. Well, you know, I lost my mom a year and a half ago.

31:11So yeah, that's a tough journey to go through. What do you think you would like to instill in your kids from your parents? I know you came from a broken home, but what do you think from them that you want to instill? I always think about the things that my mom and dad taught me, like the values, the core things. Man, my mom was so understanding.

31:38And I mean, like, down to the nitty-gritty. Like, you talk about being the wild child, like, yeah, you know, I was that kid, you know, running around with my friends doing things we're not supposed to do. And it was like I could always tell her and she was never mad. Yeah, you know. Yeah, it was like she would give me the information about why I shouldn't be doing what I was doing.

32:03Yeah. But like that feeling of love was always still there. And it's like, that's one thing I try so hard with my kids. It's like, which you talk about like getting frustrated. It's like sometimes that's something that happens almost instantly, especially in those moments where they're telling you something. It's like they're afraid that you're gonna get angry. And it's like, that's one thing I try real hard to, especially like in this last week, For sure.

32:32You know, it's like, because I've been having that thought, you know, like, what do I want them to remember? Yeah, absolutely. You know, I, um, I've mentioned this before, and I, I know David hates it when I bring up things multiple times, but, um, you've heard me say it 100 times. But, you know, one of the things that stands out to me is, is that Warren Buffett video where they asked him like, hey, what's the best piece of advice that you would give somebody?

33:00And he said like, hey, I learned from Jim Murphy that you can always tell him to go to hell tomorrow and that like it doesn't matter. And then the very next thing he said, he said, you know, they said, well, what was the worst advice? And he said, you know, he said, I've always kind of known what good advice was. And he said, you know, I don't know why this comes up, but, you know, probably the best advice that I've ever been given was not given to me by somebody giving me a piece of advice.

33:24It was shown to me. And she said, what are you talking about? And he said, well, He said, you know, if you can extend unconditional love to your child, and he said, it doesn't mean it's uncritical. It doesn't mean that you always feel like it, but if you can extend that to them, right, you're half the way home. You know, and that's always touched me.

33:41You know, that was always a big thing for me. And that's, you know, that's really what I want to provide for my kids, right? Is like, you may frustrate me, but I will always love you. It doesn't matter what you say. It doesn't matter what you do. You can always come back. You're also like, I'll give you this small piece of advice here because they're 8 and 5, like enjoy like the ages that you got right now.

34:04Yeah. Because especially the 8-year-old, you're going to turn around and she's going to be a teenager watching teenager movies, doing teenager things. And it's like, what the hell happened to my 5-year-old baby girl? Yeah, it's gone forever. So take all the pictures, take all the pictures, all of them. I find myself fortunate in that area for the reason that, uh, I was about 14 years old, I, uh, I wanted to kill myself at this point in time and happened to get out to all the school that I was in that that was something I wanted.

34:59That was something I was thinking about. And at that moment in time, I chose to, or I wanted to leave that school I was at. And my dad at the time told me, he's like, we don't run away from our problems. You know, we stand up and we own up to it. And I didn't talk to him for 4 years. I was angry and we butted heads.

35:25And it was almost like 4 years to the day that I quit talking to him. My stepmom got shot at work in a work incident, upset worker. And I'll never forget that my grandfather called me that afternoon and he You know, old school grandpa, grew up on a farm. They didn't talk about their problems. And he said to me, he's like, I don't know what to say to your dad.

35:51He's like, I need you to come here. And I literally said to him, I was like, I haven't talked to the man in 4 years. What do you want me to say? Yeah. And I'll never forget, like, thinking in that moment that it's like, dude, you've wasted 4 years here. Yeah. You know, and like, I mean wasted, like on Father's Day, I remember my stepdad at that time got a phone that was waterproof.

36:17And I remember he said to me, he's like, oh, if you, if this phone works after I drop it in my beer, he's like, you gotta call your dad. And I remember him dropping it in, pulling it out, and I took it and dropped it right back in the beer. Like I wasted time being so angry. Yeah. And like, that's another thing that I'm doing my best to share with my children.

36:41Like, don't waste that time being angry, you know? And like, that goes right along with that unconditional love thing. It's like, sometimes there's moments, and I've seen this from my dad too, where it's like looking back, would he stand on that line that he stood on then? Yeah. You know, and it's like, sometimes it's kind of worth just, you know, letting it be.

37:14Exactly, it really is. And, you know, I— It comes with time though. It does. When you're 14, I don't think you can process. No. Or at 18. I mean, that was pretty mature of you at 18 to think of that. Because most 18-year-olds are— yeah, I wouldn't screw that much. I did not have a choice though, in my opinion. Well, you know, it— but, and that's where I say like I'm fortunate.

37:36Like, you still had that introspection though, you know what I'm saying? You didn't feel like— like you're like, I've been wasting this time, I better go do something. Even though you were compelled to, that's still introspection that I don't think most 18-year-olds would have had. What, you know, and look, I get into it with Dad now sometimes too, right? And he's up there in years.

37:59And I recognize after losing Mom, like, hey, I don't have him that much longer. You know what I mean? But I look at that and I say, you know, the things that him and my brother fought about and that caused all these family problems were minor, right? They didn't matter. Right? And it was about control. It was about being right. And I look at it now and I'm like, I don't really need to be right.

38:24I don't really care. Right? And I don't care. You know, one of the things that drives me nuts is, I don't know if I've ever shared this with you, like my dad's a very religious man and he talks about a lot of religious things. And my brother took that as my dad was crazy. Right? And he thought that anything my dad said about the Lord or about God or anything like that made my dad crazy.

38:46And my brother worked very hard to keep people from talking to my father about anything about his religious beliefs or anything else, 'cause my brother said, oh, it's gonna make us all look like we're wackos. It's gonna make us all look like we're crazy. And it's like, but that's what he believes. Like, who gave you the right to decide that he's right, wrong, or indifferent?

39:04Like, if that's what he believes, it doesn't mean that's what you believe. That's why they call it faith. Exactly. And so, you know, I think now, like, he goes about his way and he says, hey, I'm gonna do this, or I'm gonna do that. And he gets mad at me and he's like, he wants to do it his way. Everybody keeps asking me, well, what are we gonna do?

39:19I said, well, he owns the damn place. We're gonna do whatever he says we're gonna do, right? Well, but I don't know if that's the right thing. I don't give a damn, right? It doesn't matter if it's the right thing or not, to a degree, right? Ain't always right. Yeah, exactly, exactly. What— so tell us, when, um, when you reached out to Dad, what was that like?

39:39Um, well, to be honest, it was very literally like in the critical care unit waiting room at the hospital after the shooting. It was so freeing to forget what I was angry about. Yeah. Let it go. It was like it didn't matter at that point. 'Cause he had kids with her and it was like, I'm looking at my little brother and sister sitting there staring at their mom, you know, my dad's wife.

40:19And it's like, and that's where like the empathy side of things for me has always won. You know, it was like in that moment, there were bigger things than how I felt. Yeah. You know, and like, A lot of my dad and I's split happened to be frustration between her and I, you know, and their hatred for my mom as far as, yeah, you know.

40:50And it was like, for the longest time, I just chose to stay angry at them and let it create this divide. And it was like, That's tough though, as a kid. It was, yeah. 'Cause that's your mom and then they're trying to build something and then it's like, divorces are such a mess. Well, and like, that's where like my belief of it being my fault started.

41:17I would sit there and listen to them talk about my mom in this poor way. And like, even before that, when my parents got divorced, I remember like the little, silly kid stuff. You're trying to get them to hug and kiss. Yeah, yeah. And it's like, I remember when they wouldn't do it, it was like, oh, I did something wrong. Yeah, you know.

41:37And then it just grew with the anxiety and them talking about, you know, how it's all— it's her fault, you know. And it's like, okay, hey, I'm, I'm part of her. That's my fault, you know. Like, yeah. And it's like, did you ever share any of that with them? Not— no, not until far later in my life. Yeah, yeah. I think they almost always know that though, but they, they convince themselves in the moment that, nah, the kids will be fine.

42:05Yeah. Isn't that a movie? There's a movie. Should burn that movie to the ground. The Kids Are Gonna Be Fine, or The Kids Are Fine. I'm gonna look it up. The Kids Are Fine. I'm telling you, there's a freaking movie about it, just about this nonsense. The kids are not fine. The kids are not fine. Sorry. In that moment, I don't think they— and I truly believe they were selfishly upset with her.

42:31Yeah. You know? Yeah. But that's how a lot of divorces are. There's so— there's a lot of animosity to where you're not— or they're not considering what repercussions are coming from their actions. For sure. You know? I talked to a technician last night and it, this kind of makes me think about that and it's super far-reaching, right? Like not, not what we're talking about.

42:56But so this technician's in this situation, he's in this shop and he got a promotion, right? And he was getting ready to leave. And so he told them, he gave us 2 weeks and they came back to him and they said, oh, we can't lose you. We're going to We're going to take care of you. They gave him all this and it was really convoluted pay plan, really weird stuff.

43:17And so we've been talking about it. And before I knew it, he was saying, hey, I'm going to take the job. And I've already expressed like, hey, I'm a little concerned. There's not a lot of details here. There's not a lot of information. So he took the job and the same day that he messaged me, took the job, I get this like rant of a text message.

43:38And he's upset. And he said, my, uh, one of my coworkers gathered a posse and they went and they talked smack about me to the manager. The manager pulled me in and screamed at me that he's not going to lose this technician and all this stuff happened. And I'm going to go in there on Monday morning and I'm going to quit and I'm going to tell them all what pieces of shit they are and all this stuff, right?

44:06And I said, hey, listen, I said, let's slow down for a minute and let's talk about this. And we started talking. And I said, I know me personally, I have an internal dialogue. And up here there's all this stuff running around nonstop. Right. And I said, has it occurred to you that maybe you don't understand the full situation? And just like you're telling yourself, these people are doing all this and this is wrong and this is wrong and this is wrong.

44:34They must be saying this about me. Yep. Have you considered that they might be doing the same thing except they think that you're the bad guy and they think that this is wrong and this is wrong and this is wrong, right? But we're not communicating about it. We're not talking about it. We're not saying here's where we're at and here's how we feel and here's what's going on.

44:50Yep. And so this morning he messaged me when I woke up. I had this message from him. He said, you know, he said, you're exactly right. He said, uh, I slept on it. He said, this morning when I woke up, I called my manager And he said, you know what I decided to do? And this, this guy's pretty hotheaded and pretty hardcore.

45:09And he said this morning, he said, I realized something. And I said, what's that? He said, I realized that the other guy was the better candidate for the leader. He was the better candidate for the foreman and he deserves it more than I do. So I've stepped down and I'm just going to work for him, but I'm going to stay. I'm like, that takes maturity, right?

45:25That takes like really thinking it through. And I think that sometimes we get moving in our head and we're telling ourselves stories and we're telling ourselves all these things that are happening and what that person must have said and what that person must have thought. But we don't know. No. You know what I mean? Yeah. And so I think about you talking about your parents and it's like, man, so much of that probably could have been solved with a little bit of communication, right?

45:48If they were willing. Yep. But the willing is the hard part. Oh yeah. You know? Oh, it's hard stuff. It is hard stuff. It's sad. It is. Yeah. So, uh, how are things with Dad now? He's one of my best friends. That's awesome. That's good. Grandpa? Good grandpa? Oh yeah, yeah, yep. That's sort of like their redemption is like— I have a terrible relationship with my parents, um, and my mom tries to be absolutely bananas.

46:20Is that why she lives with you? She said she will sit— one of the few people will set me off. She says the craziest shit. Anyway, she is a fantastic grandmother to my kids. Fantastic grandmother. That's why she lives with us. Yeah, she's great with my kids. She babies the crap out of them, which I absolutely love. She babies the crap out of them.

46:40So she's much nicer. Like, she was not this nice to me as a kid. Like, I don't remember this lady at all. This is not how she raised me. I mean, but you were you, so I guess I could understand her being really like— listen, she liked my sister. She was the baby of the family. Both my parents liked my sister. I mean, doesn't that tell you something?

47:01I guess. I don't know. I mean, like, why the rest of us look at you like we look at you. I mean, like, maybe you should— listen, my kids like me eventually, and my wife sometimes likes me. Eventually. So I'm good. If you are always the problem, maybe you should— I have just— I have a few people that like me. That's all I need.

47:21Yeah, I don't need anybody else. Everybody else can screw. Oh my God, Dave. I like to say you can either be blessed or get effed. One of the two. That's exactly right. That's right. Uh, I live in— oh, go ahead. No, you go ahead. I say I live in a small town where It used to be everybody waved. Yeah. You know, and it's like, yeah, I had posted on Facebook the one day about how I had waved at somebody and they hadn't waved back and somebody's like, oh, did that make you feel bad?

47:50And I was like, no, they can either be blessed or get effed. You know, that's exactly right, dude. I'm telling you, man, the one-stoplight towns, we used to live in one. It's gotten bigger now. And, you know, for the longest time you pass somebody, you knew who they were. Yep. Right. And that's changed a lot over the years. Where does Tyler go from here?

48:12I'm in the process of becoming shop foreman at the shop I'm working at. Very nice. Other than that, I have a, a goal, a drive, something I want to achieve in life. As somebody who, like I said, like 20-some years of my life, I didn't want to be on it. I want to help people that feel that way earlier than I did.

48:45Yeah, for sure. For sure. And it's like, I remember last year they had us write some notes and put it on a board out here, like a vision board type of deal. And I, I wrote on there I wanted to inspire love. And it was like, yeah, even just the simplest of smiles or, you know, eyes, or actually talking to somebody about them feeling suicidal.

49:14It's like, for sure, that's, that's huge. That's something I want to provide for people. Amen, buddy. Dude, I, I love that. Um, I'm sure you've heard us talk about this before in the Changing the Industry Facebook group. Yes. In the last year and a half, we've lost 7 people, right? Um, and, and probably more than the truck. And I, I know, I'm telling you, I know of 7 people within the group that are not in the group anymore because they're no longer with us because of that, right?

49:44Um, and you know, one of them was a shop owner, the others were technicians, but And these are some of them I knew, some of them I did not know. Some of them family members reached out and said, hey, I just want you to know about this. Right. I think as parents, right, like, I think that's one of the scariest things ever is like, think about how does your child feel like that?

50:08That's something because like in your case, they may not have even known. Right. And that's terrifying because when you love your children as much as you love your children, Like, that's a terrifying concept. And I think that we just had a talk earlier, and David hates these discussions, but I think there's such a stigma around mental health in men specifically. We're not supposed to talk about it.

50:32No. And it doesn't feel nice to talk about it. No, not a lot. And so I just think that I encourage people all the time, like, hey, go to therapy. Go talk to somebody. Get it out. Don't hold it inside. Talk to anybody. Yeah, for sure. But the worst part, and I'll speak from experience, when you're in those moments, you don't, you don't think about calling people.

50:58Yeah. You know, and it's like I've had 2 I refer to as attempts in my life. One at when I was 14, the other when I was 24. And when I was 24, I, you know, relationship had just ended, get done at a night out with friends at the bar. And I remember I was sitting in my mom's apartment parking lot and, yeah, pistol in hand.

51:33And holding it to my head. And I'm in that moment, I wasn't thinking about calling a buddy to tell them I felt that way. Yeah, for sure. And thank the Lord, my dog was sitting in the passenger seat and I remember just like screaming as I was sitting there and he touched my elbow with his nose and it broke that. Oh yeah, it broke that moment.

52:01And it, you know, I went inside and had a manic episode in the apartment and like my mom had to keep the neighbors from calling the cops. And right. But when I look back at that now, it's like that's one thing that I, I try to talk about a lot is like most people that kill themselves aren't— they don't— you don't think they're unhappy people.

52:26Yeah. You know, Very true. And even like me, you talk to people in my life, they would tell you I'm walking around with a smile most of the time. And it's been that way my whole life, even in those moments. Right. You know, and it's like, it takes courage before those moments to get out of them. Yeah. Because if you wait until you're there, Yeah, it's a bad spot.

52:54Right. And it's like you truly believe you are better off not being here. And you truly believe people would be better off without you. For sure. Whether that's true or not. And I think that so many people feel that way and have that kind of pressure. And there again, some of that can be the story that we're telling ourselves. Right. Right? Some of that can be the pressure we're putting ourselves that nobody else is putting on us.

53:27Nope. Right? And, and I, dude, I'm telling you, when I went to therapy, right, like, that's some of the stuff that I learned. Yes. It was me creating this. It was my mind creating this. I like to call them my own, my own demons. You know, it's like, that's one thing I tell my wife all the time. It's like sometimes the way she will act, get angry, this or that, will create a reaction in me where I'm negatively thinking about myself.

53:54And it literally has nothing to do with what she's doing. It's the trauma that I have had has developed that habit in me where it's like when somebody's angry, I believe it's my fault. You know, it's like that can stem into just crazy manic moments for a lot of people, you know? Yeah. I tell my wife all the time, she's, she's always like, why are you getting so defensive?

54:22And it's like, I'll, you know, I can go to the kitchen, I'll take a bag and I'll take that Ziploc bag and I'll put a sandwich in that Ziploc bag. And she'll say, why'd you use that bag? And I'll freak out, freak out. And she's like, what? What's wrong? And we got to talking about it. I was like, I remember my dad when I was little.

54:41And it was like, well, that bag's too big. Well, that bag's too little. Well, even though that's the right size bag, we didn't have that many of those bags. Why didn't you use that bag? No matter what I do, it's wrong. Right, exactly. And I remember that. And I, you know, I— until later in life, I didn't even— like, I saw how my grandmother treated my dad.

55:01And then I saw other members of his side of the family who treat each other like that. And that's the big thing for me is like breaking the effing cycle. Yeah, right. Because like there can be family trauma that you don't even realize is getting passed generation to generation to generation to generation. And we teach our beliefs. And, you know, one of the things that my son has really taught me, he is the most observant human being you will ever meet.

55:26I mean, this kid hears everything everybody says all the time. And he will come to me and he will say things that I was talking to my wife about. He wasn't even in the same room as us. And his perspective at 7 years old. And I'm like, buddy, I didn't mean it like that. Right. But he didn't know that. No. And they don't understand sarcasm and the little finite parts of our language and mannerisms.

55:55For sure. And you're stacking those belief systems in them. And so, man, it's important about how we talk. Yeah, it's— and, and, you know, Tanika told me one time, she said, there are days when I get home when I don't say anything to anybody. I go into my room and I shut the door. Yep. And I sit there for a little bit before I come out.

56:16And I said, why do you do that? She said, because I don't want them to experience the mom I am right then. Yeah, right. Because what I say in those moments, they will remember, right? And I don't want them to remember me like that. Like, fuck, man. Damn it, Tanika, you gotta make me feel bad about myself, you know? Dude, my oldest has a— and she don't do it on purpose, but she has a great way of kind of like bringing out the honesty in the moments for me sometimes.

56:47And like, you know, kids do something wrong and like you, you harp on them a little bit. It's habit. Yeah. But there will be times in those moments where like you'll see her get overwhelmed and then she'll go, I'm the worst. Yeah. And it's like, oh, it breaks your heart. Hey, no, that's not, that's not what Dad meant. Yeah. You know, it's like, no, no, no, no, no, you are not the worst.

57:10You, you had a bad moment and then Dad had a bad moment too, you know? And it's like, yeah, I, you know, it's like my wife, right? When, when she talks to our kids about things, um, you know, they see things on the news and they encounter things and they, you know, just like everything going on with the family business, and they'll be like, oh, that's a bad person.

57:32And my wife will tell them there are no such thing as bad people, right? There are people who do bad things, but the people themselves are not bad, right? And I think that teaching them from a very early age, because like those are things We don't realize that that becomes a narrative they tell themselves too. Right. Right. And I just, I think it all starts at home and I think it all starts with our kids.

57:55Oh yeah. You know? Yeah. Because if we can give them a good foundation and raise them up right, that's just it. That's where it's going to come from. Yeah. Brother, thank you for being here. Thank you. This was awesome. Yeah. Thank you. Absolutely. Oh dude, that was, that was phenomenal. Absolutely phenomenal. Um, and anything we can do to help you on the journey of, of spreading awareness and, and the word about that, you just say and we'll do whatever we can.

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