Ep 86 - Lucas Underwood and Tonnika Haynes | Did We Accomplish Anything Here??

0:00Mike's Hummers are EVs, but that's a little bit different, you know? Well, I mean, not EVs, they're just battery. Oh, I think that was a blowjob joke. Was that a blowjob joke? You want me to catch your blue ball? Is that what that was? Yes. I'm in here. The following program features a bunch of doofuses talking about the automotive aftermarket. The stuff we or our guests may say do not necessarily reflect the beliefs of our peers, our sponsors, or any other associations we may have.

0:30There may be some spicy language in this show, so if you get your feelings hurt easily, you should probably just move along. So without further ado, here's your host, Mike Allen, with Confessions of a Shop Owner, presented by TechMetric, the best software in the history of ever. Swipe it right for good finding. Oh, y'all know that too? Oh. Man, it's so good.

1:00So good. There's all sorts of other Dora videos on the internet. I don't think I'm gonna be looking those up. Like you don't already know what I'm talking about. I'm worried that I do know what you're talking about, but not for the reasons that you know what you're talking about. You are the dirtiest man I've ever met. Yeah, that's true. And it's not close.

1:19Yeah. So I was just making a joke for your benefit. Benji posted Yesterday they were on a road trip and they got a big 15-passenger van. I saw that and I was like, what's a bang bus? Please explain it to me. And then you step in and just with a screenshot, you Google what's a bang bus. Does anybody know the Benji story?

1:39Have either one of you ever heard the Benji story? Which Benji story? The Benji story at the community college that I have on video that he is so bothered by. So he was talking to one of my apprentices. Right? And we're doing a panel, and I asked Jim and Benji to do the panel, but it was like completely out of Benji's— like, he just wasn't expecting it and didn't really know where to run with it.

1:59And at some point in this panel, he looks at Nico, who is my employee, and he said, "At least you have a boss that won't come down your throat." And I swear to God, the entire room shut down. I mean, everybody just burst into laughter. It was awesome. He's a Marine, come on. Yeah, I didn't know what he was doing. No, when he realized it, when it came all the way through, when it came down his throat, he knew exactly what had happened.

2:27I mean, we all have gaffes, right? Like it. Not me. No, my mind doesn't work that way. You have to see it. We are. You have to see the signs. Come on. I'm so proud of you. I'm so proud of me too. What am I proud of you for? I am proud of you because I feel like just a number of years ago, you were afraid to come to ASTE.

2:46You didn't want to come to ASTE, and I felt like— I was like, man, she's so cool, I wish she would come to this and hang out with us. And it felt like I was having to work really hard to get you to even like come out at all, and you really wanted to be at home and you didn't want to be part of what we were doing.

3:02And now here we are, you got a podcast and you're doing really cool stuff and you're on the board and you're like, everybody wants to hang out with you. Yeah, everybody's looking up to you. Can't walk across the lobby at the hotel because you get pulled in 100 directions. Yeah. Yeah, all the— I love it, but then it's exhausting. You know what I really like about it is I like all of these young women who come up and talk to you that are in this industry.

3:23Yeah, that's my favorite part. Because I think that so many of them feel like they don't belong and like it's almost like you give them permission to belong. I think that's really cool. But it's just, what is it, Rick? Like, is this a story you're telling yourself? Like, nobody told me, like, oh, what are you doing in here? Nobody ever said that privately.

3:37Yeah, for sure. Well, I mean, I think that we do that. Let's be fair. It's got to be intimidating. I mean, you now, it's not you from 5 years ago because you've developed relationships with all the people that come to these events. 5 years ago, you're a Black woman showing up by herself into a room full of old white dudes. That's exactly what I said when I walked in the door.

3:59It was like I called my service advisor at the time. I was like, Amber, I was like, it's just a whole bunch of old white grumpy people in there. It's like, we weren't grumpy, we just look like we're grumpy. Yeah. And then everybody looked like they were pregnant. That was the Bob days. Bob did a great job growing the association. He did.

4:17And he saved the association in a time of need and helped grow the expo. Now, and look, I'll just tell you right now, I mean, there were a lot of good things there. I mean, I got involved because of him. You got more involved because of him. I mean, he was passionate. He was. Yeah. And he knew the industry and he talked to people and he went door to door from shop to shop.

4:36Yeah. Like nobody I've ever seen do. Yeah. Oh, let me tell you something. I'm, I'm kind of feeling like there's a deal here. I'm not gonna lie to you. I feel like there's a little bit of a deal here. I've not said anything to him about it, but I feel like he just thought, oh, well, Tanika and Imbi are coming in, they'll clean this up.

4:55It's fine. It's like, it's kind of like his shop. He's like, yes, I know I've just destroyed it. Yeah. He's like, I know I've already destroyed my shop. I checked all that, but I have to fix that. I was like, I'm gonna get me two black women to come in here and clean up everything that the old white guys fucked up. And about the time, and if it goes, look, if it goes great, I laid the groundwork for success.

5:17And if it's a shit show, I'm gonna be like, them black women fucking everything up. You can do that? Oh, damn it. COVID would mess you up. Oh, I'm telling you. Hey there, I'm gonna tell you about something that has completely transformed how I run my shop. TechMetric. As a 20-year shop owner, outdated systems used to slow us down. Everything was clunky from check-in to estimate building to customer updates.

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6:10Stuff like integrated payments with buy now, pay later options is a huge asset. Ask me how I know. And recently they've added a CRM component with their partnership with ShopGenie, which I'm a happy ShopGenie customer already, so I'm super excited about that. Obviously there are a lot of factors at play here, but I want to give you some some facts about my business since I made the change to Tekmetric.

6:31In September of 2020, when I switched to Tekmetric, my ARO was $293. In September of 2024, we were $916. That's over 300% growth. Now, I'm not saying that Tekmetric created all of that change, but I'm 100% saying that I couldn't have come this far without Tekmetric. It's a key factor in our growth and success. If you're ready to level up your shop, Tekmetric has everything you need— productivity, Revenue, customer experience.

6:58Measure up by every measure with Techmetric. Tap the link in the show notes to learn more. Hey guys, Kari Lynn with Turnkey Marketing. If you are looking to increase cars and you're looking for the right demographic to go after, you want to get the right people who need auto repair right now, then give us a call. We have a service called Direct Track and it utilizes AI to find people in your area who are the great demographic that you want to go after, have raised their hand and opted in saying, I need auto repair help right now.

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7:49It has been incredibly effective. It has made shops seem like they're everywhere to those people who need repairs right then. And I mean, I'm telling you guys, the return on investment has been huge. So if you want to increase car count, you want to get great people in the door, give us a call or reach out to us and ask us about Direct Track Marketing.

8:10I think there's a reason that Mike was trying to fade himself out pretty quickly because he knew like, oh man, they will, they will end me over this. Well, they'll also, uh, you know, you have a level of competency and you can grow an organization until you start bumping up against the roof of your level of competency. Yeah. And I think it's pretty obvious that about 6 or 7 days into my presidency, we bumped up against the roof of that level of competency.

8:36Yeah. And somehow I managed to just— she thought hours— I pulled the clutch in and just coasted all the way to the finish line. And now you guys are having to clean up all the mess that I left behind. I just appreciate it. Yeah, look, I just— look, man, I love you very much. You are easily one of my very best friends, and I just need to say I told you so.

8:55That's all I'm going to say. I mean, that's really all. I will tell you, you are the one that suckered me into being the VP. Yeah. And then, like, I don't know if you noticed this, but I maneuvered very aggressively. And why the heck did you do it? Because he did it. Oh, I thought you said he would. I did. You're exactly right.

9:16I was— I had only been on the board. I'd only been on the board for a year, so I didn't know what I was getting myself into. And then it was like, ah, you know, vice presidency is not a ton of work. It's mostly just a couple of— it's like a couple of meetings a month. And I was telling Tricia, I'm like, gosh, I have so much going on in my life right now.

9:36Things are so complex right now. And You know, I don't— you wish your life right now was as complex as it was back then when you were having a conversation. Money. I'd pay money for that. I would pay. It's all about frame of reference, brother. Well, you got to be superstar podcasters and all of that stuff. This is my— this is my relief.

9:56This is really— yeah, this is where I relax and can like actually see the world for what it is. For me, I want to have a conversation, the three of us, because you've been podcasting for several years now. I've been podcasting for a year. You've been podcasting for a month, right? Right. So we got 3— we got 3 levels of maturity in our podcast.

10:16Yeah. You have allowed it to become, I believe, from, from the outside looking in and from our friendship, it's what you're most passionate about is maybe not specifically the podcast, but being involved in the industry as a whole and being a voice for shop owners and speaking to shop owners to try to help them. Right? Maybe to the detriment of your business.

10:40Yeah, absolutely. Because of your travel schedule and your attention and how much time it takes versus time in the business. I started a podcast because you beat me into submission telling me to start a podcast over and over and over. And it's a lot of fun and I really enjoy it. And it's a little bit intoxicating because people are like, oh, you're so funny.

11:02Yeah, right. And who doesn't love hearing people tell them that, you know, that they're awesome? Yeah. And I stopped paying attention to my business to the detriment of my business. So I'm here to tell you, girl, because you're going to be fucking awesome. Yeah, it's going to be your second show on the scene. You released your second episode today. I was with Jeff Compton.

11:21I think you recorded it at Apex. Is that right? When did you record? No, it was recorded just the other day. Oh, well, the screen cap that he used for the thumbnail was from Apex. But you are going to grow more rapidly than either of us have, just because of the energy that you bring to it and because of your style. And there's a framework now.

11:41We have a framework for how this works. Don't let it take your eye off the ball. Yeah, I think I kind of watched you watch me fuck my business up. Well, I think there's a lot that went into you fucking your business. Mostly it was me. Mostly it was me fucking myself. Me too. Me too. And I'll be honest with you, I ran into a wall much like you did with the presidency of ASTA, where I recognized I'm just not capable of running my business at the level it should be right now.

12:12Right? I'm just not good at it. Did you not put the people where they should be, or did you— were not at that point that you wanted to put the people? I love people. Like, I I will sacrifice what's best for me and my family for other human beings because I love people and I want people to be happy. I want people to be healthy.

12:33I want what's best for other people. And sometimes I see things in other people that they don't see in themselves and they don't want for themselves. And so I have spent a lot of energy trying to raise up and develop culture, teams, and people to the detriment of my business. I stopped that a couple months ago. Yeah, you know, I know how it feels to be Captain Saberho.

12:56Yeah, yeah, he's like, oh yeah, I can, I can, I see something in you. But then that person doesn't see anything themselves. Yeah, like the last person, I looked at him, I said, you know what, I'm done. I don't do my own recruiting anymore. Nope, I hired Sarah. I was like, no, I am not running the business based on my feelings anymore.

13:12Now once you're in there, you're established, and you my people, I got you. Yeah, but I'm not going to waste my time loving you more than you love yourself. Yeah, um, just to recap, Captain Save a Hoe. Captain Save a Hoe. All right, copy. I'm not here to save everybody. I, um, would we save a bro for you? Huh? Would we save a bro for you?

13:32Captain Save a Brew. Yeah, I can save a bro. It depends on when you're efficient. You employ a higher percentage of hoes than Yeah, I'm mostly bros. I've only got a couple hoes. So, but I mean, I've got— I'm offended you said that. Are they in different area codes? Yes. Yes, yours definitely are. Um, I don't know, Tanika. I mean, I think that I had this really wild experience, right?

14:04Like, so somebody I really care about and cared about, and they really hate my guts now. Came to work for me. And right when they came to work for me, they basically told me, hey, you're a bad leader and you're a bad manager, and I don't think that you should be managing the shop. And I said, okay, well, I'll go find a manager.

14:22And so I went on search for a manager, and I found somebody, and they checked all the boxes. I talked to coaches, I talked to my mentors, I talked to all these people, and this person checked the boxes. And I look up and I realize that The person who told me that is still having the same number of problems and the same challenges and the same issues that they were having before.

14:43Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, definitely. And now I've got a giant fucking mess of a business that I've got to clean up. Let me— okay, so my dad did something when I was in college. I'm 20-some years old and I didn't agree with what he was saying and I was mad and I'm like, yeah, go tell everybody. So I went and family gossip Like, oh, Dad did this and Dad did that.

15:05And you know, and they were like, oh, I wouldn't work for him. You know, you don't have to work for your dad. You don't have to do that. Whatever. And it got back to Daddy. Right. Um, I don't know what it was, but I remember what he said when it got back to him. Mm-hmm. He said, next time you want to go talk about me or you want to get an opinion of me, make sure you get it from somebody that's better than me.

15:22Yeah. Amen. Like, so if you took that information that you were a horrible leader from the guy that was mopping the floor, then that's on you. This was somebody who— I mean, I see where you're coming from, but a dude who's mopping the floor can tell if his boss is a terrible boss. But what you don't get it from is the dude who you fired who used to mop the floor, and you fired him because he had a drug addiction problem, but he didn't want to tell anybody else that, that you gave him 10 chances and that he came to work late and that he was asleep in a customer's car because he was stoned,

16:01you know? Yeah. Is this real? No. Oh, you're just making up something. This is not real. Yes, I'm totally making it up. And it's like, oh, Mike's an asshole. He's a bad leader. Like, look, I'm an asshole and I'm a bad leader, but I wasn't an asshole to you, bro. You're a fucking drug addict. And I gave you a ton of chances.

16:20Well, and that was the thing is that there was no accountability. And this is somebody that I felt like I could trust. Trust. This was somebody that I felt like really was part of the industry and engaged in the industry, and I thought that they were in a very different spot than they were. But why did you think that? I had— this was a relationship that was multi-years old.

16:40This wasn't something that happened overnight. They got you with the okie doke. Yeah. You get okie doke. Yeah. Yeah. That's happened to me. Yeah. And I, you know, and so now I think we've got Jade's back. Jade's managing the shop. I think we've got a good grasp on things. The shop's not doing the revenue that it should. The expenses are way too high, right?

17:02And the family business stuff is consuming a lot of energy too. But I think we're, I think we're headed in the right direction. Are you traveling anymore between— I guess we should specify that we're recording this at Vision. Vision. Yeah. Vision 2026. You guys have been here for 2 days, 1 day. I just got here today. I had my kids play last night.

17:24It was awesome. They did great. And flew in this morning. Have you been able to kind of reel it back a little bit? Are you doing anything between now and Tectonic? Yeah, I've got to go to New Jersey for the Northeast show. I looked up and I was going to be home 4 days in April, 9 days in April. April's a busy month for sure.

17:48So I said, I don't know that this is sustainable, right? That's not, that's not what you signed up, it's not what your wife signed up for, right? Well, and I mean, like, dude, that's going into the busy season for the family business. That's getting the, that's where the shop starts hitting the busy season. I just, and I nixed them, and I upset some people.

18:06I hurt feelings, and I feel really bad about it, but I just said, like, Initially, we said, hey, you're not going to comp our rooms. I'm not going to be able to come. But there was a bit of personal, like, hey, I don't. And believe it or not, y'all pick on David all the time. He came to me and he said, no, I'm fucking nixing this.

18:25We're not doing this. This is too much. Like, because the family business is open 7 days a week. I work 7 days a week, right? I work Saturday and Sunday. Now, not every Saturday and Sunday, not all day Saturday and Sunday. Does that make you an evil business owner? Yeah, absolutely. Making your employees— yeah, getting rich off of your employees' labor 7 days a week.

18:45Yeah, it's bad. It's really bad. I'm only open 5 days a week, Lucas. Well, you're advocating for 7 days a week? Nah, lasted 9 months. Yeah, there's a whole story about that. We'll share it one day. So, uh, I love you so much. Lucas tried to bait me into that story just a minute ago. And I didn't take the stinky bait. You guys both know the story.

19:11But yeah, we did what we could. It'll be all right. That's funny though, because you have walkie-talkie videos with hundreds of thousands of views and comments and shares and loves about you should be able to do your business 5 days a week. And I think in our business— Well, but I mean, here's the thing is like theoretically we could close and we did for a while.

19:34We could close Tuesday and Wednesday with the other business and give them days off. What's up, guys? So if you know me at all, you know that I think I'm pretty awesome at everything, right? But the reality is I get so busy that a lot of things fall by the wayside. And one of the things that I've always really enjoyed is actually the process of hiring and recruiting.

19:52But as the business grew and as the podcast has grown, I just don't have time to react quickly like you have to to be competitive in the recruiting market. That we have right now. That's why I've partnered with Promotive. I've used their full-service recruiting process also to great effect for technicians that were like immediate culture fits. That was awesome and useful. But what I'm really excited about is their new tool, Page.

20:15If somebody applies to one of my job listings, Page contacts them immediately and has an interview with them. By the time I get the information, I already know if they're worth the time and effort to jump on that applicant quickly or not. It saved me a ton of time with bad applicants. It's prepped me really well for good applicants. It's just a super effective, super useful, super efficient tool to help me stay on top of my hiring and staffing needs.

20:40If you want to learn more about their full service recruiting process or about their new tool Page, go to info.gopromotive.com/confessions or scan the QR code below. Though I'm going to tell you something, it is again much money and you're evil, so you don't get Well, but here's the other thing is that is a completely different demographic. If I've learned anything from this whole thing, right, it's that human beings in different phases and different parts of their lives behave immensely differently.

21:11Right. And so these like you go from and I'm not saying that the people there aren't skilled. Please don't take it as that. It's not what I'm saying. But I am saying that's really what he's saying. There's a difference between the shop and the type of work that they do and the skill level that they have and the financial requirements they have.

21:29And then what you do up there, right? The stress level up there is very differently or very different. Who you got behind us? Nobody's behind you. I just can't believe you didn't hit record on that camera. Are you serious right now? No. Why? Why you got that? I will fucking kill you. But, but y'all grow up. Yeah, but the people up there are subjected to a different type of stress.

22:06They're subjected to a different type of environment. It's, it's retail customer service type stress, right? Yeah. And the stressed out mom with 3 kids who are misbehaving and tearing up the store and Yeah, yeah. And so it's, it's a very different environment. And I, I think it's, it's awoken me to, um, and me and you have talked a lot about that. There's a lot of different ways to do business, and I used to paint with a very broad brush.

22:30And, and I, I think I was influenced by people that we care about and love very much, and I'm bad for that. And I have got myself in bad situations because I've listened to people that have a very hardline approach, and I'm learning that maybe everything doesn't have to be such a hardline approach. It's not one size fits all, man. Yeah, for sure.

22:48That's the glory of the independent aftermarket is that you get to do it the way you want to do it. Yeah, as long as you're ethical and you treat your people right and you treat your customers right, I don't give a fuck how you do it, man. Go make that money. Yeah, for sure, for sure. I love when you're sitting in a seminar or in a class or whatever, and they're just, this is the way to do it, this is the way to do it, and the people with the narrow mind, they don't see it.

23:08Like, okay, yeah, they gave you all these ingredients, but if you don't like garlic powder, don't put it in the dish. Like, don't do it. You don't just have to dismiss the whole thing. Well, and I think one of the big problems— like, we are independent, we are very fractured as an industry, right? Because there's so many different ways to do it, and we all believe that our way is the only way to do it.

23:28Um, but you go talk to, like, talking head guru coach X, and they've got their fans and their detractors, and Y, and they've got their fans and their detractors, and they all believe that their guy is the best thing since sliced bread and this guy is fucking Satan, right? And here's the deal. 90% of what they teach is the same. Yeah, absolutely.

23:54And so, like, how people get so wrapped up in it. That's right. Yeah. So it's There is a bit of a cultish mentality to it. There is a bit of an over-the-top, this is— Well, and I can get it. If you've been working 90 hours a week, working your fingers to the bone, you're stressed out, your marriage is on the rocks because you're never home, you don't know your kids, and you're making $40,000 a year because you don't know how to run a business, and you— somebody drags you to a coaching event and you sign up with a coach Your life is going to change dramatically in year 1, period.

24:31As long as you're not a dumbass and you're not willing to make changes. If you're willing to make changes, your life will be better than it's ever been before just getting some coaching. And so it's natural for that person to have a fierce loyalty to and belief in the person that pulled them out of that ditch. But that doesn't mean that it's the only way to fucking do it, right?

24:52And if you go to this class and you're like, you know what, I disagree with free diag. Yeah. That doesn't mean that everything that happens at Car Fix is terrible. Right. Right. I mean, just because I know Car Fix, I disagree with cheap oil changes. That doesn't mean that the free diag— okay. I disagree with Saturdays. So, right. I disagree with wearing your lanyard, which is rubbing your microphone.

25:17Braxton had nothing to do with this baby doll. I swear to God. You know, and I think over the years of having all of these discussions, right? Like, because we've had some really deep discussions with people over the years. Of all the years of having these discussions with people, I probably shouldn't say this, but I will. I answer between 250, 300, sometimes 400 messages a week.

25:46A week, right? Nope. And I talked to a lot of shop owners and a lot of technicians who are in like a really bad place, right? We sat across, there's a dude sitting in that chair right there and he was telling his story today and he was telling about his shop and, you know, really sharing about how awesome his shop is, this, that, and the other, right?

26:06And then somehow we shifted into this thing about health. And he said, you know, he said, I was ready to retire at 45. He said, I was done. He said, I'm 40 years old. He said, I was gonna make it 5 more years, I was gonna be done. And David and I kind of looked at each other because it sounded like we just turned on a different side road, right?

26:22Like went in this completely different direction. And he said, yeah, he said, I had some health problems. David said, well, what— you know, David's on this big health kick. He said, well, what's your health problems? He said, it was a heart thing. And he said, man, he said, I was so stressed out. He said, I was working 7 days a week. He says, working a ton of hours.

26:38I gained a lot of weight. He said, I made up over 300 pounds. He said, I was a big boy. And he said, this weird thing started happening. He said, went home, and he said, when I would sit down, when I finally got home, 1 o'clock, 2 o'clock in the morning, he said, I'd sit down, he said, my heart would race up to 214, 230 beats a minute.

26:55And he said, I feel really weird, get really dizzy. And he said, they thought I was, you know, going through something. He said, they did all this blood work, checked all this stuff out, and said, hey, this is, this is stress Panic attacks. And well, what it was, it's called an adrenaline dump. And so David and I went and looked it up and it's a real thing.

27:11Like you, you can come down from like putting yourself through that and you can get an adrenaline dump that's over the top and drive your heart at a really high level. And I mean, like we see so many shop owners that are in really cruddy situations. We see so many techs that are in really cruddy situations and those are human beings, right?

27:30Right? Whether you agree with them or not, anything that helps them get out of the situation they're in. Because I was there one time, right? I mean, like, when I walked through that front door, I still tell people, because like, you know, Bob walks over to me, he says, you must be Lucas Underwood. And I just thought that was the coolest thing ever.

27:48I didn't realize there were only 16 people there. He knew the other ones have already checked in. Yeah, exactly. But like that, that moment and that— and even though like he and I don't always see eye to eye, like he changed my life with what he said to me, right? And I just think that we have, not just as podcasters but as human beings, we have immense responsibility.

28:13We joke and we laugh and we cut up, but we have immense responsibility. The words that come out of our mouths because we impact and influence other human beings to do things, you know. Same thing with the coaches. So what, like you were saying, it was more than one way to do anything. Yeah. What scares me is, okay, you helped save my shop, my marriage is doing better now.

28:31When do you get off the coattails? Like, when do you take responsibility? Like, do you go to that coach for everything? You'll help me do this, help me do that. Will you become a strong enough person to run your own business? There's a lot of dependency built in, right? Because so would a coach allow you to just become dependent on them? Yeah, I have a real problem.

28:49It seems like it would be a time to graduate from a program. Yeah, me and you have had talks about that. I have a real problem with that. I have a real issue. There's a lot of coaching organizations out there. I don't think we need to name any by name, but that to a degree the business has reached its goals and maybe the owner doesn't desire further growth.

29:10They're like, I don't want to have 20 locations, I don't want to do $100 million, whatever. So maybe they, maybe they want 3 stores running at Redline very effectively and they've got that and they maintain their relationship with that coaching organization because it has become their fraternity. Yeah. So they're paying for that. Yeah. So they're— and you know what, if you got the money and the coaching organization is okay with that, okay.

29:34As long as it's not a detriment to the other clients, right? When you go to meetings and 15 people in the room have known each other for 10 years and they know each other's businesses intimately and they're all hitting their goals and there's no press for growth and the other 5 feel like they're kids on the outside looking in and there's no interaction.

29:54Yeah, that sounds familiar. Yeah, yeah, I mean, and, and what would you do in that? Like, I'm, I'm not a weak person, I don't think that I am, but when I was feeling like that, I was like, you know what, I'm not paying to be nobody's friend today. Yeah, this is, this is crazy. And then you get in the company that lets that one person that refuses to do the work hold everybody else behind.

30:14There's, there's 2, maybe 3 organizations in automotive coaching that actually have a curriculum and a system built out that provides a pathway. Right. There's very, very few coaching companies that they Somebody posted in one of the groups the other day and said like, hey, where are all these automotive coaching people coming from? And because I moderate all these groups, like I see all these people and it's one right after another.

30:42Oh, now I'm a coach. Oh, now I'm a coach. Oh, now I'm a coach. Just so you know, when you post in those groups anonymously, Lucas knows it's you. And then he takes a screenshot and shares it with everybody. Yeah. Just especially Mike. Especially Mike. Yeah. And so it's interesting to me because I think that one, many of these people realized how hard running an automotive repair shop is.

31:11It's a lot easier to coach people and they see a potential revenue stream. It's not about improving the industry. It's not about helping people. There are a lot of people who are helping the industry. I'm not saying that. But I also think that in large part, those people are not focused necessarily on developing that system. They're not true educators. They're not true coaches, right?

31:37One of the things, you know, about AVTECH, right? Mm-hmm. One of the reasons that I got so hot and heavy over trying to help them is because it wasn't just that Dave went out and said, I'm going to start a certification program because I want people to be certified. Dave went to school to learn about certifications, got a PhD in credentialing to understand it because he said, there's a problem and I want to fill a need.

31:59I want to fix this. He got a PhD in credentialing? Yeah, it's some crazy title. I couldn't even begin to tell you what it is, but it is all about understanding how to determine somebody's competency. Right. That's all he trained about. And so if we can learn how to do that, I think these automotive coaches who make millions of dollars by charging people to fix their businesses, I believe that they could implement a curriculum and a system that moves the people through that.

32:27How— wait, our employees all think that we make millions of dollars at the shop, right? How many coaches do you think are making millions of dollars? I've seen some P&Ls. I can think of two that I think are probably in seven figures. I didn't say gross or net. I can think of 2 that I think net millions of dollars, and that's probably it.

32:52I can tell you of 4. Okay. Well, I mean, good on them. I don't fault them that. Yeah. With modules to check for competency and have a diploma. Holy shit, guys, it's the Podcast Network coaching company! Bet! Hey, Jeff Compton is going to be our lead coach. Handshake deal, no paperwork, no partnership agreement. Yeah, we'll just all promise that it's going to work out.

33:26Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know, do you know when we started the podcast? I got I got a lecture that said, you're going to stop giving away the cheese. And I said, what are you talking about? They said, you're giving away all the low-hanging fruit and it's making us look bad. So here's the thing. Outdated SMS just, they don't just slow you down, they cost you money.

33:46And I learned it the hard way. Before Tekmetric, I was wasting time on inefficient processes, manual updates, back and forth calls with customers. Now I handle everything in one place. DVI, customer communications, payments, real-time reporting. It's all in one page. Since making the switch, my average repair order has jumped from $293 to $916. And it's not just me. TechMetric powers almost 10,000 shops nationwide.

34:12By the time you're hearing this, it probably will be 10,000 shops, helping them grow and operate smarter. If you're tired of losing time and money to outdated systems, tap the link in the show notes and see what TechMetric can do for you. Was it your coach at the time? Okay, that's surprising to me. That's okay, we all grow, we all grow, right?

34:33Yeah. Oh no, I, I have no hard feelings now or anything like that. It's nothing like that, nothing like that. Well, I mean, these are the first 10 steps you need to do in your shop. That was what the ASOG Mastermind was all about, was like, hey, let's, let's help people. Let's solve some basic problems so they can get a coach. And I think after we did that, people started realizing like, hey, this isn't going to— timeout.

35:01Uh, we're 35, 40 minutes into this episode. Um, welcome to Confessions of a Shop Owner with your host Mike Allen. I've got two guests with you today. I've got, um, the podcast diva in the automotive industry, Miss Tanika Haynes with The Downshift with Tanika. And then we've got a new startup. We think he might make something out of it, maybe not. But Lucas Underwood of, um, the ASOG podcast, I think it was.

35:27Yeah, yeah. Uh, so yeah, I like that. I think he's got a lot of talent and passion, so hopefully he'll make something of it one day. One day, probably not. My, my son, um, I don't know how, he was at his buddy's house and the podcast came up and his dad was like, oh, he's got a podcast, that's cool. And he texted me, he's like, hey, uh, so-and-so's dad, uh, you got a new listener, he's gonna listen to your podcast.

35:50And I was like, oh no, fuck, fuck. Uh, and so they dropped my son and his buddy off at a card show at the convention center or wherever it was, and then they went out to run errands, whatever, and they picked him back up and said, so we listened to one of your dad's episodes. I was like, oh Jesus, oh Jesus, which one was it?

36:12He said, I don't know which one it was, but he said, they never introduced who the guests were. I had no idea who was talking. And he curses a lot. And some, I mean, this is a very straight-laced family. Valid, valid. Took their son out of the Christian school that my kids go to because it wasn't quite straight-laced enough. And I drop MF bombs every episode, right?

36:37And so I don't know if they're allowed to hang out anymore or not. Oh, that's rough. But I got a follower, so. That's right. Mike will drop trowel for your subscriptions. I will split trowel for the reel. I'm sorry that you had to go through that story. It is terrible. That is a pretty, pretty rough one. Pretty rough one. What are you gonna do?

37:02Hey, it's life, man. It happens. All right. You, like, you've got the show and you've got the family business, uh, and you get the shop, which has been neglected for a little while. 2026, is that the year that you focus on the shop some more, or do you not have the bandwidth yet? Um, 2026 is the year that I implement EOS in both businesses.

37:27Do you have an implementer or a coach that's going to help? Not yet. That, that's one of the things that I've been talking Institute about. We think that we would like to work towards implementing because they do have people who are certified implementers. And so we're talking about maybe a system that helps shops implement EOS in that I desperately need help being able to manage the amount of things that come at me.

37:52I'm somebody who like a lot of shit comes at me, I lock up. Yeah, right. And so I don't know what to do. I just, I've got so much that I need to do. I don't know which thing to do. I should tell you that you're an idiot. Like, yes, exactly. That's what it looks like when shit gets real. Lucas just changes the subject.

38:09He's just like, hey, look at this. Yeah, that's exactly right. That's exactly right. Braxton, don't ask about your paychecks anymore. So you're very much a visionary. You're in It takes one to know one, right? But you need somebody who's detail-oriented and boots on the ground. I see a lot of parallels. You're very much a people pleaser and you care desperately what people think about you.

38:39Yeah, and that's where the similarities stop right there. Mike does care what people think. No, it's one of the reasons that I struggle with managing my business is because I don't have the hard conversations. Yeah, because I want, I want desperately for people to think that I'm an awesome fucking boss. And so my payroll, I mean, my payroll was way too high.

39:00Mine too. My accountability level was way too low. Yeah, um, my— but what's weird is I didn't have a brother that was that much superior to me, and I, I still feel that way. So it couldn't have been— that's weird because I didn't either, because I'm so much better than him in all the ways that matter. I mean, like, we know I don't know how he's latched onto that, like he thinks it's a major insecurity for me, just because I told him it was a major insecurity that one time.

39:30I know, every time you see them with Lucas, every time you see him with his brother, it is written all over his face. You could take a magic marker. Oh, my brother does listen. Okay, so last month my brother called and he was like, hey, both of my cars are just about paid off and trying to figure out if I'm gonna keep them or get rid of them.

39:52So one of them, his wife's car is an X7 with like 125,000 miles, and I was like, fucking get rid of it, it's about to kill you. And he's like, okay. And his truck, he's got a Yukon Denali pickup, 2500 6.2, or is it 1500 with the 6.2? '62, 150,000 miles on it. Also get rid of it, right? It's time to go.

40:16Um, and he's like, well, I'm thinking about this, I'm thinking about this, I'm thinking about this. And I was like, just fucking don't do any of that. Those are all bad choices. Don't bring that shit to me. So what did he do? He went and he replaced the X7 with a used X7M, and he's replacing the GMC with a Hummer EV. Let me just be real with you.

40:40I would, you know, if he was superior to me, I would feel bad about myself too with decision making like that. You no longer think he's superior, do you? Because those are some bad fucking choices, Brent. No choices. No, I'm just saying that. I'm just saying that I don't know that. I don't know that the superiority changes. It just lowered you down.

41:00He's still, he's still superior., but he's much lower now and still superior. So it just lowered us both. Yeah. Copy. That's great. That's great. So, no, but it was like a series of conversations over several weeks where he acquired the, the X7M and then he was like, yeah, I'm really just kind of finding all the reasons to talk myself into making a poor choice.

41:25I was like, you're gonna get the fucking Hummer. Yeah, I am. Dude, come on. That is awful. Yeah, I mean, Mike's Hummers are EVs, but that's a little bit different, you know? Well, I mean, not EVs, they're just battery. Oh, I think that was a blowjob joke. Was that a blowjob joke? You want me to catch your blue ball? Is that what that was?

41:48Yes. I'm in here. We're terrible people. So you don't ever do this kind of stuff on your show? This is just— no, we don't know if you do or not. I don't actually listen to it. Yeah, we do. Do you listen to your own show? Do you listen to your episodes? A little bit here and there, not much. I'll watch reels and stuff like that.

42:12It depends on what it is. Like, there, believe it or not, there are a couple people that we've talked to that said really impactful, really intelligent things I go back and listen to, and I don't necessarily listen to myself, but I'll go back and listen to like some of the advice they gave and stuff like that and try and implement it in the shop or implement it in the family business.

42:32I consume significantly less podcasts and social media in general. Because you know how the sausage is made. Yeah, I think there's some truth to that. Yeah. So, but you know, Braxton and Brian and I are texting at like 5:30 most mornings because he gets up early and Braxton just responds when he wakes up at 10 or whatever time he gets up. Yeah, um, but it's usually 11:30.

43:01He'll be like, he'll be like, hey, such and such a reel's getting hot, you need to go respond to some comments. I'm like, nah, bro, do you know how I know when something's wrong with one of our episodes? Is when any of your viewers tell you? No. Any one of the episodes, your episodes, my episodes, any of the shows. The only way I know is when Jeff messages me and says, hey, it's because Jeff actually watches them all and listens to it all with intent because he is striving intentionally to get better every day.

43:29And I just want to tell dick jokes, uh, and hang out with my friends, which is why I don't get better. Working on getting sponsors, the question that I'm getting, are you under the umbrella? It's like, I'm not under their umbrella. Then I know the question— what umbrella? I ain't under no umbrella. Ella, Ella, Ella, Ella, Ella. Oh, that got, that got hot quick.

43:53Um, well, it's because we do have a lot of stuff under the umbrella that most people don't even know is under there, right? There's a lot of shows, and there's more shows coming that y'all don't know about yet. Actually, I've been asked to be a guest on one of them. Yeah. And then the lady who's hosting it was like, ah. Even better than that is we've started working with this group of people and there's lots of things getting ready to change, but we've got some discussions to have about some big stuff, right?

44:22Big stuff that we wouldn't have even thought would even be potential. But there is also, we brought in some people who have set up a complete system. And the person that we hired has ran really large podcasts in the past. They started as a virtual assistant for a podcaster that's very, very well known. They learned the system, and then they came out and they started developing these systems on their own.

44:45And so we've hired them, and they're developing a complete production system. I showed you what that looks like. Everything's color-coded, it's automated, there's a process for approvals, there's time frames, there's everything. And so they just handle It just goes through this system. And so there's a Trello board set up, and you just— if it comes to me, it says, hey, this is something Lucas approves, this is something David approves.

45:05I click yes, I click no, I'd like to change this, I'd like to change that. There's standard operating procedures for everything we're doing now. And so it's— well, but here's the thing, is like, I think David and I wanted this to be fun, and we wanted to have a good time with this. We didn't want it to be a job, but we recognize now that if we didn't want it to become a job, that we were not going about that the right way.

45:29It was becoming stressful trying to keep up with everything. The way to keep it from becoming a job and still have fun with it is put people in place that can do the job part, because it's still a job. Let's put, let's put you on the therapy couch. Are you ready? Mm-hmm. I am concerned for you because you're a people pleaser. And you also, like me, are uncomfortable having the uncomfortable conversation, so let's just do it on tape.

45:54Since you tried to bait me into one and I skipped it, I'm gonna just like— yeah, bull in a china shop into yours. I love it. I'm worried that your show is growing so well and your influence is growing so well, you don't understand and appreciate the influence and impact you have in our industry, and everything you've got is on a handshake and a wing and a prayer, and it's just like, hey, let's just fucking do it.

46:16Great. Okay, cool. Yeah. No, I think about that sometimes. You need a business agreement, bro. Yeah, I think about that. But again, I'm not doing this for any type of financial anything. And I have decided that I am okay if it all blows up tomorrow. I'm okay with it. Yeah, but I mean, like, like the CTI group, the CTI group on Facebook.

46:39It's worth a lot of money, bro. It's worth a lot of money. And you put a— you put an enormous amount of work into that and energy and your, your soul in there, right? And responding to people and helping people. So you don't want that to just blow up. But also, I don't. But I, I am working really hard to get okay with no matter what happens.

47:05Being okay. And so if it all falls apart tomorrow, I'm gonna be alright. Yeah, you'd be alrighter. Yeah, well, no, I'm making some moves on that. I'm going in that direction. That was what a conversation today was about. No, no, I'll tell you about it. But no, we're talking about making some of those moves and doing some of those things. The thing— what happens if you like— I mean, this is a question for all of us, right?

47:42And this comes down to succession planning. What happens if you had a heart attack tomorrow? How many families are seriously— So far they've been fairly minor, so it's not that big of a deal. Yeah. I don't have a complete succession plan. I don't need some in place for my business. Like, payroll would happen, the bills would keep getting paid, but is there a roadmap to the business being sold for maximum value so that Amanda can get that money and go do it?

48:14Just had that conversation with Alex just the other day that we don't have that. But, you know, there's that, and then there's like, for you, there's the family business also. And then there's— I mean, Changing the Industry podcast is not Changing the Industry podcast. It's not the podcast without you. The Facebook group still has huge value. And so how do you ensure that all these things that you have built that have great value that other people depend on don't suffer and die if you're suddenly taken out of the equation?

48:45I have— I have sacrificed tremendous amount of money on life insurance, so they will be okay if something happens to me. And I've tried to put things in place that'll make it okay. I cannot make the family business okay, okay? Uh, there is no making that okay, no matter what I do. I can't, I can't make it okay. Um, that's taught me some valuable lessons, right?

49:10Like, I, I can't fix that. I can't clean it up. I will, and I'm going to, but it's it's going to take me a long time. If something happens to me tomorrow, I can't, right? Like, it's gone. There's no saving. I couldn't buy enough life insurance to save it if I wanted to. Well, at that point, it's just the asset, right? It's the mountain.

49:30It's owned by the federal government at that point. Copy. So, well, fuck. Yeah. Yeah. Better go sling some parts. Yeah, well, I'm— that's what my thing is. I'm learning like, hey, there's things I can't control, right? And big challenges come my way, and I'm looking at life saying, no matter how hard the next step is, it's the pathway up, right? Like, it's preparing me for the next challenge.

50:01It's preparing me for the next hard thing. My dad's getting older very quickly. Like, we can see it. My brother came to me and said, I feel like every day I see him, he's more wobbly, he's less capable, he's— right? I mean, if that happens, I— dude, I've got 124 individual accounts I got to figure out how to get access to. I don't even know.

50:22So what I mean, you need to figure the answer to those questions out right now, not if something happens to him. They're not even— they're not even in— some of them aren't even in his name. He doesn't have access. We don't even know what some of them are. Right? And so it's— we've, we've crossed some thresholds that make that very difficult to gain that access and to navigate through that and to make enough time to make that happen.

50:43And it's not just that. I mean, there's lots of complexities with all of this. I've got another brother who's involved, and I want to make sure that the same thing that happened to us doesn't happen to him because of my choices. And so I have a responsibility to try and do my very best with it. Is there any chance that all the turmoil around the business could suck Allen in?

51:03Or is it pretty clear, free, it's separate, the real estate's totally separate and everything else? I've got a note on that property. It is still in Dad's name, but it's owned by a different organization, so it's free. It's fine. And I'm the one who pays the note on that, so nothing could happen. That we believe. There was a, there was a conversation that happened 3 years ago, um, It's longer than that now, 4 or 5 years ago.

51:27There was a conversation that happened that set all this in motion, okay? Things had been happening for a long time that I didn't understand. The person in question, I've got to be careful what I say, the person in question. Don't discuss anything that you don't want to discuss. No, it's fine, it's fine. The person in question would call and say things and like, they would seemed like they were trying to get you riled up or say, hey, there's this concern.

51:53It was like they were trying to get you on their side, right? And sometimes when you talk to them, they would get frustrated about something. They would say, I just wish Mom and Dad would just go ahead and die so like I could just, you know, go on with my life. And I just always took that— and it happened to my other brother too— and I always just took that as this is just, this is just frustration talking.

52:17And shortly after that, there was a conversation. Mom called really upset and she said such-and-such said, like, another family member said those exact words to them because my dad had asked for something to be cleaned up. And so I called and I said, hey, look, this is really none of my business. I'm just saying, like, I think your mom and dad— it's absolutely your business at that point.

52:41Fuck whoever said that. Well, I'm just saying, like, I just feel like I understand whose mouth that came out of to— for it to get to the next person, for it to come out. And I understand that because I say something when I'm 18 and 19 years old, that doesn't necessarily mean how I feel, right? I can be hotheaded, I can be a dumbass, I can say things I don't mean, but that doesn't mean I don't regret them later, right?

53:02And I'm like, hey, this is going to have a tremendous negative impact later on. Like, you— when they think back about about what happened. That's going to hurt when Mom and Dad aren't here anymore. And in that conversation, something came up about where I built the shop. And that conversation included, well, I'm paying for all that. And I said, no, you're not.

53:24I've got a deed— or not a deed, but I've got it financed. It's owned by this. It was owned by Mom and Dad, and then they own that. And so it's a completely separate piece of property. And directly after that, every decision seemed to be about destroying the business. But they didn't understand that I held the note on the property. So if the other business stopped paying all the bills, the bill would still get paid.

53:49And then they went batshit crazy over it. And I think they intentionally tried to sink the business because they thought up until that point, they realized they'd made a major gaffe, right? Because they thought up until that point, well, if I sink the business to the point it all gets foreclosed on, I can buy it all back, not realizing that I own the other piece of property that I was paying the bill on it.

54:11So even if they didn't pay the bills, that wouldn't get foreclosed on. And so that's the only logic I can think of that makes any of this make sense. And I'm telling you, this has taught me one thing. It's that even if your whole world blows up and in front of you. Even if what you believe to be true, even if what you thought was going to be the rest of your life and how things were going to play out doesn't work out, you're going to be all right.

54:37So, like, if there's somebody who's listening to this or watching this who's got a family business, like, I— we've been talking a lot about partnerships as of late, right? Because partnership is hard, but family business is really hard too. You know, my— I think I'm very fortunate that my brother went the path that he did because he went in the military. Got way more successful.

55:01Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, I think it would have been really hard for the two of us to be business partners together. Yeah. And there would have been power dynamic struggles and there would have been butting of heads and that kind of thing. So, um, and we got to go shortly, they're knocking on the door outside, but What advice would you give? Or you, because you're in a family business too.

55:27Yeah, step number 1, um, as parents, set very clear guidelines. Don't just put it in a will, don't just put it in a trust. Say, here's exactly what's going to happen. From a very young age, from the moment that you have an idea of what you're going to do, put it on paper and talk to your kids about it. Make sure it's very clear.

55:44All the way through. That's what my parents did. I'm very thankful. Yeah, absolutely. And it was updated every year. Yeah, 100%. There's a folder in the safe. Here's the plan. Here's what my desire is. Here's how it executes. I'm sure there's something in his head and he talks about it, but if something happened to him, I wouldn't even know where to start.

56:03Well, pick up the phone. Yeah. So the next thing that has to happen is there has to be a buyout protocol. There has to be something that says, here's how we're going to determine the value of the business. There is no— this is not exception. This is the method to establish share price. Exactly. Period. This is how it works. Because you love someone, because you care about someone, does not mean that they are mentally well, does not mean that they are mature, does not mean that they're going to make right decisions.

56:32So loving someone, thinking that they will always have your best interest in mind, does not guarantee they're going to have your best interest in mind. You have to trust but verify. Every single thing that you talk about with that person, you either do it by text or by email. You document every single thing you say, and you have other people who are signers on accounts, but every one of your checks needs two signature lines on it, and it needs to be required that both signature lines are signed before a check goes out.

57:04Every single time. How to avoid family business clusterfucks 101. Lucas Underwood, we could continue this conversation for another hour. I feel like I've got probably 250 to 300 lessons I've learned out of this. Well, thank you for sharing. I appreciate it. Of course. Absolutely. Thank you for watching us be children. I appreciate it. All right, listen, listen. This is where you plug your show.

57:28Braxton cuts it out, puts it at the very beginning. Is that what it is? What we're gonna— I feel like that's what we're gonna do. Again, I'm not a plugger of the show. Hey, uh, go online and watch your shit. It's awesome. Yeah, not— it's not like OnlyFans where you can pay to watch her shit. No, no, no, no, no. Let me tell you something.

57:45Let me tell you something. Jeff Compton, his tall world, would pay to watch Tanika. Of course. What, are you kidding me? He's got such a crush on her. Um, what? I love him so much. So much. You guys are so sick. Don't put that man out like that. Listen, listen, I'm just telling you, I'm just telling you right now, I'm just telling you right now, Jeff has taught the entire automotive technician world something very important, okay?

58:07It is huge. It's a big deal. He says that you can get free trials to each one of those things, and then you just unsubscribe before they charge your card. He's got it figured out. He said you can also like do some sort of chargeback thing or something, and I'm like, no, that's dirty business, man. Yeah, yeah, that was my gal. The only one of those sites that I have a subscription to is feetfinder.com, and that's just so I can check on the new content from my big buddy Brian.

58:35Oh man, I'm— hey, I should show you a size 15E. I showed him a picture of my toe and he thought that that was disgusting. Dude, I've got so much fungus on my left big toenail right now, man. I'm gonna have to have the toenail Listen, I, I got these little like black spots underneath my toenail because I guess I dropped something on at some point, and then I kicked something the other day.

58:53Well, it did this weird thing, it turned sideways underneath the cuticle, and so it got stuck underneath the cuticle, and now it's split and it's like turned up and all these little weird curly things. It's odd. I do not talk about any of these things on my podcast yet. That's why you should watch. I hope it never happens. Um, but yeah, watch.

59:12Tanika, can I be on your I love you. I can't even get you to sign up and answer my phone calls. Don't even try me, girl. I don't even want to hear it. Every single time you have ever called me, I've answered or called right back. And that's a wrap for me. Thanks for listening to Confessions of a Shop Owner, where we lay it all out— the good, the bad, and sometimes the super messed up.

59:34I'm your host, Mike Allen, here to remind you that even the pros screw it up sometimes. So why not laugh a little bit Learn a little bit and maybe have another drink. You got a confession of your own or a topic you'd like me to cover? Or do you just want to let me know what an idiot I am? Email mike@confessionsofashopowner.com or call and leave a message.

59:51The number is 704-CONFESS. That's 704-266-3377. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to like, subscribe, or follow. Join us on this crazy journey that is shop ownership. I'll see you on the next episode. All right guys, AI class. Learn how to use AI so that you can make it your bitch and you don't become its bitch. Saturday, June 13th, Seth Thorson's teaching a full-day class in Raleigh, North Carolina.

1:00:52Tap the link in the show notes or scan the QR code on your screen to learn more. It's going to be awesome.